How is Cantlay not getting penalised?

[CasualLie]

Need to start penalizing players. 5% or 10% of the FedEx Cup points the player would earn from the event for every slow play penalty. This won't take them out of the round mentally like a stroke penalty would but the repercussions of losing those points over a whole season could be meaningful enough to make some players speed it up.

 

That is on the right track. I was thinking you start assessing slow play shot penalties at the scorer's table. Send out an official with a "shot clock" with every player, and just take notes. Sorry Patrick, before you sign for that 68, we got you down for 4 shots of slow plays, sign for a 72.

[elwhippy]

He is purgatory. Horsfield tweeted he knows he has an issue and is doing something about it. Cantlay is getting beyond belief. The 2019 rules revisions are about speeding up play but obviously touring pros will be exempt...

[Noke]

Slow play is out of control and it's done at every level of tournament play. Case is point. At my club last week there was a PGA section sanctioned junior tournament. My foursome teed off behind the last group of 3 girls. These girls were top notch players as this event was for a select group of those that were the best in the section. They teed off at 12:00 noon. We teed off at 12:15pm. We waited forever. Standing on the 4 tee box it was 1:49pm. It took them 1 hour and 34 minutes to play 3 holes.

 

Here's what we observed:

 

- Countless practice swings

- Forever to pull the trigger and hit the ball

- Constantly studying their yardage books

- Walking up all the way to the green if they were 100 yards or in

- Aimpoint "express" on every putt from all 3 players

 

This group did lose their position and was warned it didn't help. One girl was trying to get the others to get moving but the other 2, both Korean, wanted no part of it and their parents were offended.

 

This is because junior programs do not teach how to maintain pace. Shot clocks are needed at all levels of play.

 

I bet you and your group were just hopping mad at those Koreans.

 

lol

[bladehunter]

The real issue is with the TV networks. They have zero incentives to push for shorter rounds.

 

Longer rounds = more ad $$$ = more $$ to pay for broadcast rights = more $$ for the Tour = more $$ for tournament purse = more excuses for players to play slower

 

Imagine if the network said the broadcast window only goes to 4 hours from the start of the final group + 15 min for post round activities. The Tour would be jumping through hoops to get people to play faster.

 

 

would probably lead to them just showing the back 9 like they used to do , and run more ads....

[Swisstrader98]

I have a guy that was in my regular foursome that makes Cantlay look downright speedy and we have put him on the clock on a few occasions. Guess what?? Changed nothing. He’s still slow as molasses after 100’s of ppl have told him it’s painful and at an amateur level, no one is about to penalize the guy.

 

Tour won’t really do all that much about it as well. I don’t know what the stats are but just guessing that in all the years they’ve had the penalty for slow play, very few have actually been penalized.

[davep043]

Tour won't really do all that much about it as well. I don't know what the stats are but just guessing that in all the years they've had the penalty for slow play, very few have actually been penalized.

The Tour is the players, and the players don't want to penalize the players. It just might be "me" who gets the penalty, and I won't vote for something that might cost "me" a penalty stroke. I'm sure a few would support increased enforcement, but not many.

[jimb6golf]

Cantlay especially needs to be penalized for slow play - it's impossible to watch him and he's easily one of the most annoying golfers to watch. But there's plenty of others including Bradley, Day, Dechambeau, etc. The PGA Tour needs to enforce their own rules and speed up play as it's getting tough to watch and stay interested. This weekend listening to Dechambeau and his caddy discuss hitting 1/2 yard shots and then watching him fly the green just proves that it's not that precise and they need to make a decision and hit the damn ball.

[pinhigh27]

I have a guy that was in my regular foursome that makes Cantlay look downright speedy and we have put him on the clock on a few occasions. Guess what?? Changed nothing. He’s still slow as molasses after 100’s of ppl have told him it’s painful and at an amateur level, no one is about to penalize the guy.

 

Tour won’t really do all that much about it as well. I don’t know what the stats are but just guessing that in all the years they’ve had the penalty for slow play, very few have actually been penalized.

 

So either stop playing with him or don't complain.

[larciel]

He just has most annoying pre-shot routine and that's why all the missiles are headed his way.

[duffer987]

Slow play is out of control and it's done at every level of tournament play. Case is point. At my club last week there was a PGA section sanctioned junior tournament. My foursome teed off behind the last group of 3 girls. These girls were top notch players as this event was for a select group of those that were the best in the section. They teed off at 12:00 noon. We teed off at 12:15pm. We waited forever. Standing on the 4 tee box it was 1:49pm. It took them 1 hour and 34 minutes to play 3 holes.

 

Here's what we observed:

 

- Countless practice swings

- Forever to pull the trigger and hit the ball

- Constantly studying their yardage books

- Walking up all the way to the green if they were 100 yards or in

- Aimpoint "express" on every putt from all 3 players

 

This group did lose their position and was warned it didn't help. One girl was trying to get the others to get moving but the other 2, both Korean, wanted no part of it and their parents were offended.

 

This is because junior programs do not teach how to maintain pace. Shot clocks are needed at all levels of play.

So which group was Cantlay in?

No one gives a sh1t about your cracker anecdote.

[Darth Putter]

A snail playing with slightly faster slugs isn't getting penalized.

[bladehunter]

I say I say , what the hells happening here ?

[ebrasmus21]

Slow play is out of control and it's done at every level of tournament play. Case is point. At my club last week there was a PGA section sanctioned junior tournament. My foursome teed off behind the last group of 3 girls. These girls were top notch players as this event was for a select group of those that were the best in the section. They teed off at 12:00 noon. We teed off at 12:15pm. We waited forever. Standing on the 4 tee box it was 1:49pm. It took them 1 hour and 34 minutes to play 3 holes.

 

Here's what we observed:

 

- Countless practice swings

- Forever to pull the trigger and hit the ball

- Constantly studying their yardage books

- Walking up all the way to the green if they were 100 yards or in

- Aimpoint "express" on every putt from all 3 players

 

This group did lose their position and was warned it didn't help. One girl was trying to get the others to get moving but the other 2, both Korean, wanted no part of it and their parents were offended.

 

This is because junior programs do not teach how to maintain pace. Shot clocks are needed at all levels of play.

So which group was Cantlay in?

No one gives a sh1t about your cracker anecdote.

 

Plot twist - Cantlay was all three girls.

[duffer987]

A snail playing with slightly faster slugs isn't getting penalized.

Yup. That and Dave's reply pretty much sums up the state of (slow) play.

There will never be a marked improvement.

I've not watched anything since the Ryder Cup and doubt I will until Pebble/Riveria and I don't expect to see any improvements in 4 months time or 4 years time.

[80sFredriksson]

There would need to be some sort of uproar from the fans to make any significant change, petition that a huge amount of people have signed or something similar handed over

[80sFredriksson]

I would also like to see a fastest and slowest player on tour yearly award as voted by the players themselves

[bscinstnct]

They should send them to Angel

 

Hits before the applause dies down ; )

 

[BeerPerHole]

Funny this comes up. I have been watching his preshot routine with fascination. The directors have the camera on him obviously not realizing he's only 10 seconds into a 45-second routine. It's kind of funny to watch.

[the bishop]

They should send them to Angel

 

Hits before the applause dies down ; )

 

Love that avatar bsc! Back when men were men and smoked on the course and then afterwards getting liquored up!

[davep043]

There would need to be some sort of uproar from the fans to make any significant change, petition that a huge amount of people have signed or something similar handed over

I think that that what it would take is a significant decrease in viewership by the fans. Decreased viewers means decreased advertising revenue which means decreased revenue to the PGA Tour (i.e. the players themselves) as contracts get negotiated for future TV rights.

[johnseg]

And unfortunately this crap translates to recreational golf because your tour wannabes want to do the same garbage as tour guys do.

 

I don't see that much. Not that I'm saying people aren't slow here but I just don't see the tour sauce translating at any of the courses I play.

 

That is, unless the tour players are 2 fisting beers from the cooler, hitting on the cart girl, checking their phones, not playing decent cart golf, etc...

That is really the recreational problem. People aren't ready. They hit multiple shots. They have to finish their story before the next swing. I see very few guys that have to look at a putt from all four sides or pacing off distances etc.

[mister2cool]

The real issue is with the TV networks. They have zero incentives to push for shorter rounds.

 

Longer rounds = more ad $$$ = more $$ to pay for broadcast rights = more $$ for the Tour = more $$ for tournament purse = more excuses for players to play slower

 

Imagine if the network said the broadcast window only goes to 4 hours from the start of the final group + 15 min for post round activities. The Tour would be jumping through hoops to get people to play faster.

The problem with this logic is twofold. One, you can only push a longer broadcast time so far before you start losing viewers. You just end of sending more people to the DVR which offers the fast forward button and no ads. Two, the network does not have anything else to show for a next program to generate ad revenue???

...

 

Network does have other programs, but golf is one of the more lucrative ones with the amount of ads they can cram in, and the viewership being considered to be higher income group. Remember when the Grammy's Red Carpet show being bumped by Farmer's Insurance Open? https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/cbs-shows-golf-instead-grammys-red-market-people-003957883.html. How many other type of programming can you do nearly 40% commercial?

 

In today's professional sports, the ones holding the checkbook has all the power. It is not the Tour, or the USGA or R&A. It is absolutely true that they would lose viewership as the broadcast are getting longer. Some have turned to DVR as you mentioned. Personally, I don't even have the patience for DVR anymore and have very much stopped watching all together, and turned to Youtube for condensed version from time to time. However, the draw of live competition would still attract many to the broadcast.

 

Until such time that so many of us are fed up with the pace of play and decided that enough if enough, I really don't have time for this BS, the networks won't feel the pain and the need to make some changes. Remember what it took for the Oscar's and Grammy's to really impose time limit on speeches? It's not because the Academy's felt the events were becoming too long. It's because the ratings have dropped to historical levels as viewers thought they were getting ridiculously long.

 

Even if the tour decides to do something to speed up the play, it'll be some time before that can propagate down to the amateur ranks and to the weekend golfers.

[bscinstnct]

They should send them to Angel

 

Hits before the applause dies down ; )

 

Love that avatar bsc! Back when men were men and smoked on the course and then afterwards getting liquored up!

 

Thanks, ya, I used to smoke

 

Marlboros! Man, back in the day you could smoke in restaurants, airplanes, everywhere! Everybody was smokin their brains out. I quit like 20 years ago cause me better half beat me senseless with a loaf of Italian bread after I tipped an ashtray full of butts onto the rug.

 

But, to this day, still remember how good a cig was with a scotch or after a meal.

[Wildwing55]

It's agonizing. The days of John Daly and Jim Gallagher, playing quickly, are over.

[m5power]

I hate Cantlay and all other slow playing tour players. As a personal protest, I look for what's in his bag and make it point to never play or wear any of the gear he's sponsored by.

[Moleman]

Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole. Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole. Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole. Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole. Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole. Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole. Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole. Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole. Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole. Shuffle shuffle, look at the hole.

.

.

.

.

.

Swing....

 

 

Not annoying at all! :)

[Railroading13]

I don't get why a shot clock is not implemented

[Vindog]

The real issue is with the TV networks. They have zero incentives to push for shorter rounds.

 

Longer rounds = more ad $$$ = more $$ to pay for broadcast rights = more $$ for the Tour = more $$ for tournament purse = more excuses for players to play slower

 

Imagine if the network said the broadcast window only goes to 4 hours from the start of the final group + 15 min for post round activities. The Tour would be jumping through hoops to get people to play faster.

The problem with this logic is twofold. One, you can only push a longer broadcast time so far before you start losing viewers. You just end of sending more people to the DVR which offers the fast forward button and no ads. Two, the network does not have anything else to show for a next program to generate ad revenue???

...

 

Network does have other programs, but golf is one of the more lucrative ones with the amount of ads they can cram in, and the viewership being considered to be higher income group. Remember when the Grammy's Red Carpet show being bumped by Farmer's Insurance Open? https://www.yahoo.co...003957883.html. How many other type of programming can you do nearly 40% commercial?

 

In today's professional sports, the ones holding the checkbook has all the power. It is not the Tour, or the USGA or R&A. It is absolutely true that they would lose viewership as the broadcast are getting longer. Some have turned to DVR as you mentioned. Personally, I don't even have the patience for DVR anymore and have very much stopped watching all together, and turned to Youtube for condensed version from time to time. However, the draw of live competition would still attract many to the broadcast.

 

Until such time that so many of us are fed up with the pace of play and decided that enough if enough, I really don't have time for this BS, the networks won't feel the pain and the need to make some changes. Remember what it took for the Oscar's and Grammy's to really impose time limit on speeches? It's not because the Academy's felt the events were becoming too long. It's because the ratings have dropped to historical levels as viewers thought they were getting ridiculously long.

 

Even if the tour decides to do something to speed up the play, it'll be some time before that can propagate down to the amateur ranks and to the weekend golfers.

 

 

Nothing saying that it can't move it's way up instead of propagating down. But the basic problem is the same whether it be on tour or on the weekend : Nobody wants to do anything about it, even though they can.

[IVM]

I think Cantlay has a slow heart beat .

[augustgolf]

They should send them to Angel

 

Hits before the applause dies down ; )

 

Love that avatar bsc! Back when men were men and smoked on the course and then afterwards getting liquored up!

 

Thanks, ya, I used to smoke

 

Marlboros! Man, back in the day you could smoke in restaurants, airplanes, everywhere! Everybody was smokin their brains out. I quit like 20 years ago cause me better half beat me senseless with a loaf of Italian bread after I tipped an ashtray full of butts onto the rug.

 

But, to this day, still remember how good a cig was with a scotch or after a meal.

 

 

Reminds me of the old Steve Martin joke line:

 

Do you mind if I smoke???

 

Not at all - do you mind if I fart???