The Open @ Carnoustie (NO POLITICS)

[Sean2]

I am watching the Irish Open, and that course is proving to be quite a test, and the weather is perfect today...sunshine, hardly any wind. I can't imagine what Carnoustie will be like.

[JD3]

Gary Player wasn't the best of his era either then. Neither were Cotton and Armour. Add an "s" and say Carnoustie favors the best players of an era except Lawrie?

Fine with me, but Maybe for some meaningful stretch like padrick he was though. Idk don't want to go thru the history books to find out lol...but Player is one of only 4 career grand slam winners in the modern era, so it's quite possible he was. Not some one hit wonder like Lawrie, that's for sure.

And no I dont accept the argument you only outperformed a guy in victories because he was on the DL...you can only play against who shows up. If I guy isn't healthy enough to tee it up, then by definition anyone in the field is already ahead of him.

[iteachgolf]

Gary Player wasn't the best of his era either then. Neither were Cotton and Armour. Add an "s" and say Carnoustie favors the best players of an era except Lawrie?

Fine with me, but Maybe for some meaningful stretch like padrick he was though. Idk don't want to go thru the history books to find out lol...but Player is one of only 4 career grand slam winners in the modern era, so it's quite possible he was. Not some one hit wonder like Lawrie, that's for sure.

And no I dont accept the argument you only outperformed a guy in victories because he was on the DL...you can only play against who shows up. If I guy isn't healthy enough to tee it up, then by definition anyone in the field is already ahead of him.

 

Tiger won as much or more in 2007 or 2008 alone than Harrington did his entire PGA Tour career. Their results aren’t comparable.

 

Lawrie has 9 victories including one last year, and has made 2 Ryder Cup teams. He’s far from a one hit wonder.

[Bye]

Gary Player wasn't the best of his era either then. Neither were Cotton and Armour. Add an "s" and say Carnoustie favors the best players of an era except Lawrie?

Fine with me, but Maybe for some meaningful stretch like padrick he was though. Idk don't want to go thru the history books to find out lol...but Player is one of only 4 career grand slam winners in the modern era, so it's quite possible he was. Not some one hit wonder like Lawrie, that's for sure.

And no I dont accept the argument you only outperformed a guy in victories because he was on the DL...you can only play against who shows up. If I guy isn't healthy enough to tee it up, then by definition anyone in the field is already ahead of him.

 

Tiger won as much or more in 2007 or 2008 alone than Harrington did his entire PGA Tour career. Their results aren’t comparable.

 

Lawrie has 9 victories including one last year, and has made 2 Ryder Cup teams. He’s far from a one hit wonder.

 

Lawrie is a quality player, but he finished a couple of hours before the last group in 1999 and the weather turned bad. Then there was the Van de Velde moment on the 18th. Fair play though, he went through final qualifying and hit some career long iron shots on the last day.

[Jimmy Mac]

I'll be at Carnoustie for Sunday's round. Then in St Andrews Monday/Tuesday to see practice rounds for the Senior Open.

 

Any advice for a first-time visitor to Carnoustie / The Open? Great viewing locations? Things not to miss?

[sekrah]

Other than that hack Lawrie, course seems to favor the best player of that time, over several eras.

 

The Open Championship

2007 – Padraig Harrington.

1999 – Paul Lawrie.

1975 – Tom Watson.

1968 – Gary Player.

1953 – Ben Hogan.

1937 – Henry Cotton.

1931 – Tommy Armour.

 

Harrington wasn't close to the best player of that time. And Lawrie has had a decent career.

 

Harrington wasn't the best player of that era, but he was definitely playing at a pretty high level. He was 10th OWGR entering The Open, and then won The Open and PGA the next year year, reaching 3rd on the rankings. To say "He wasn't close to best player of that time" is patently false. He battled in that tier of players right behind Tiger Woods.

 

Lawrie was 159th in the world when he won.

 

It's not false. Tiger had like triple the number of OWGR points. He was so far in front of everyone it wasn't event close.

 

Here are his events from that British Open to the US Open, his last event of 2008. Harrington wasn't close to this level.

 

 

Nobody said Lawrie was better than Harrington but he's far from a hack.

 

 

Tiger is a once in a generation freak. Knocking Harrington for not being the very best at a time when the one of the greatest of all time was playing is very disingenuous. Harrington was elite.

.

[iteachgolf]

Other than that hack Lawrie, course seems to favor the best player of that time, over several eras.

 

The Open Championship

2007 – Padraig Harrington.

1999 – Paul Lawrie.

1975 – Tom Watson.

1968 – Gary Player.

1953 – Ben Hogan.

1937 – Henry Cotton.

1931 – Tommy Armour.

 

Harrington wasn't close to the best player of that time. And Lawrie has had a decent career.

 

Harrington wasn't the best player of that era, but he was definitely playing at a pretty high level. He was 10th OWGR entering The Open, and then won The Open and PGA the next year year, reaching 3rd on the rankings. To say "He wasn't close to best player of that time" is patently false. He battled in that tier of players right behind Tiger Woods.

 

Lawrie was 159th in the world when he won.

 

It's not false. Tiger had like triple the number of OWGR points. He was so far in front of everyone it wasn't event close.

 

Here are his events from that British Open to the US Open, his last event of 2008. Harrington wasn't close to this level.

 

 

Nobody said Lawrie was better than Harrington but he's far from a hack.

 

 

Tiger is a once in a generation freak. Knocking Harrington for not being the very best at a time when the one of the greatest of all time was playing is very disingenuous. Harrington was elite.

.

 

Please show me where I knocked Harrington once. You can’t because I didn’t. Me stating that he wasn’t the best player isn’t a knock at all. It’s factual. He’s going to likely be a Hall of Famer.

 

Don’t make things up because you wanna argue. I never said a single negative thing about Harrington.

[c7015]

I think a few are took the post too literally, can we agree Carnoustie historically identifies a great champion.

 

I think it's a pretty cool thread that does not need to be driven into the ground with TW vs the world.

[MattyO1984]

One thing I'm interested to see is how many of the field will be up for the challenge mentally, you are going to get some crazy run/bounces of the ball when its this dry and lot of players may not like it.

 

Interesting chat with Andrew Coltart prior to round 1 of the Irish he was hearing on the player rumour mill that a number of players were complaining it was unfair that you couldn't stop the ball. Coltart reckons if thats the attitude you have no chance of winning.

 

Coltart is absolutely correct. Does it being firm and bouncy make it more difficult, yes but does it make it unfair? Not at all. You just have to golf your ball in a different way.

[MattyO1984]

I'll be at Carnoustie for Sunday's round. Then in St Andrews Monday/Tuesday to see practice rounds for the Senior Open.

 

Any advice for a first-time visitor to Carnoustie / The Open? Great viewing locations? Things not to miss?

 

For me, Carnoustie is much better as a spectator than the Old Course. At the Old Course you are stuck on the outside constantly and it has hard to see the greens because the ropes are so far away. Also as it is pretty much goes all the way out from the 1st to 7th before the loop and then coming all the way back on 12th to 18th it is hard to get caught up on too much.

 

Carnoustie is much more self contained. The 8th and 9th are the furthest out the Championship course goes and it still surprises me how close you are to the hotel. If you can, get behind the 6th tee. It is really cool to see how the Pro's take that shot on.

[Ralphyboy84]

Yup won’t be able to get behind the 6th tee. There’s a lot of really good grandstands though that cover a few holes. There’s one behind the 3rd tee that also shows you the 5th green and 6th tee. There’s a good one on the 8th that shows approach shots into 7, all of 8 and tee shots on 13. Then there’s one on 13 that lets you see the 12th and 13th green.

 

In my opinion it’s a great course for spectating on

[thecraw]

Other than that hack Lawrie, course seems to favor the best player of that time, over several eras.

 

The Open Championship

2007 Padraig Harrington.

1999 Paul Lawrie.

1975 Tom Watson.

1968 Gary Player.

1953 Ben Hogan.

1937 Henry Cotton.

1931 Tommy Armour.

 

 

 

Absolutely pathetic. Champion Golfer 1999 deserves better and some respect. An absolute gentleman and a true champion in every sense, I actually take insult at your flippant remark.

[c7015]

I think a few are took the post too literally, can we agree Carnoustie historically identifies a great champion.

 

I think it's a pretty cool thread that does not need to be driven into the ground with TW vs the world.

 

So few questions

 

As a member what hole is your personal nemesis?

 

We have had a few LPGA tournaments at our course and it's always fun to see them play the course and witness their nuanced strategy.

 

Are you going to try and get in the ropes (standard bearer etc)

[Jasonic]

If TW can get his putting figured out, he will contend.

 

NOPE

[Marco]

If TW can get his putting figured out, he will contend.

 

NOPE

 

hmmm yes, gtfo

[iBanesto]

Other than that hack Lawrie, course seems to favor the best player of that time, over several eras.

 

The Open Championship

2007 – Padraig Harrington.

1999 – Paul Lawrie.

1975 – Tom Watson.

1968 – Gary Player.

1953 – Ben Hogan.

1937 – Henry Cotton.

1931 – Tommy Armour.

 

Harrington wasn't close to the best player of that time. And Lawrie has had a decent career.

 

Harrington wasn't the best player of that era, but he was definitely playing at a pretty high level. He was 10th OWGR entering The Open, and then won The Open and PGA the next year year, reaching 3rd on the rankings. To say "He wasn't close to best player of that time" is patently false. He battled in that tier of players right behind Tiger Woods.

 

Lawrie was 159th in the world when he won.

 

It's not false. Tiger had like triple the number of OWGR points. He was so far in front of everyone it wasn't event close.

 

Here are his events from that British Open to the US Open, his last event of 2008. Harrington wasn't close to this level.

 

 

Nobody said Lawrie was better than Harrington but he's far from a hack.

 

sekrah said Harrington was in the tier behind Tiger. He/She never said Harrington was as good as Tiger. No one was during that period.

 

But Harrington when grouped with Tiger at that point in time, had the best scoring average out of all other players.

[Bingo1976]

If TW can get his putting figured out, he will contend.

 

NOPE

 

hmmm yes, gtfo

 

Carnoustie will kill you if you can't keep your ball in play and in position, probably even more so if the ball is running. If Tiger can play a Hoylake type 1 iron game then he can contend - it's not a hard course to putt on, but you have to get to the green first....

[lowheel]

I am watching the Irish Open, and that course is proving to be quite a test, and the weather is perfect today...sunshine, hardly any wind. I can't imagine what Carnoustie will be like.

 

Very demanding off the tee but if its dry alot of driving irons off the tees will neutralize some of the danger. I actually think it plays tougher wet

[dcmidnight]

Please show me where I knocked Harrington once. You can't because I didn't. Me stating that he wasn't the best player isn't a knock at all. It's factual. He's going to likely be a Hall of Famer.

 

Don't make things up because you wanna argue. I never said a single negative thing about Harrington.

 

Everyone knock it off and get back on topic.

[iBanesto]

If TW can get his putting figured out, he will contend.

 

NOPE

 

hmmm yes, gtfo

 

Carnoustie will kill you if you can't keep your ball in play and in position, probably even more so if the ball is running. If Tiger can play a Hoylake type 1 iron game then he can contend - it's not a hard course to putt on, but you have to get to the green first....

 

I don't think the way Tiger played the 2006 Open can ever be repeated.

 

That was ridiculous. These courses are way too long to just be hitting long irons off every driving tee box.

[Gem]

If TW can get his putting figured out, he will contend.

 

NOPE

 

hmmm yes, gtfo

 

Carnoustie will kill you if you can't keep your ball in play and in position, probably even more so if the ball is running. If Tiger can play a Hoylake type 1 iron game then he can contend - it's not a hard course to putt on, but you have to get to the green first....

 

I don't think the way Tiger played the 2006 Open can ever be repeated.

 

That was ridiculous. These courses are way too long to just be hitting long irons off every driving tee box.

 

I would disagree.

Into the wind you would still need a driver but if it is calm than irons will travel 300yds or more on baked fairways.

[Marco]

If TW can get his putting figured out, he will contend.

 

NOPE

 

hmmm yes, gtfo

 

Carnoustie will kill you if you can't keep your ball in play and in position, probably even more so if the ball is running. If Tiger can play a Hoylake type 1 iron game then he can contend - it's not a hard course to putt on, but you have to get to the green first....

 

yep depends on the wind.

 

btw did someone delete my post ahah ?

[Ralphyboy84]

I went down to the course tonight for my last look before the open starts next week (I’m off to Cabot Links/Cliffs on Tuesday and get back to Carnoustie Sunday morning).

 

Course is looking sensational. It’s reallt starting to brown up. We had about 5 mins of rain but that’s the first rain we’ve had in weeks. The forecast looks dry and hot up until the Championship starts.

 

So far we’ve had Adam Scott and Justin Rose play this week. We’ve also had Matsuyama play as well. Through an interpreter he said afterwards “that’s tough”.

 

Patrick Reed and Matt Kuchar were here today. I actually saw Kuchar in the restaurant after. Really nice friendly guy. I’ve heard from guys watching that he hit it pretty poor but his wedge game from inside 100 yards was ridiculously good. Aparrently Reed took a golf cart out. Living up to the “Fatrick” knickname!

 

All in all the town is buzzing and excitement is building!

[Ghostwedge]

"Fatrick" ... must be a term of endearment.

[iBanesto]

I went down to the course tonight for my last look before the open starts next week (I'm off to Cabot Links/Cliffs on Tuesday and get back to Carnoustie Sunday morning).

 

Course is looking sensational. It's reallt starting to brown up. We had about 5 mins of rain but that's the first rain we've had in weeks. The forecast looks dry and hot up until the Championship starts.

 

So far we've had Adam Scott and Justin Rose play this week. We've also had Matsuyama play as well. Through an interpreter he said afterwards "that's tough".

 

Patrick Reed and Matt Kuchar were here today. I actually saw Kuchar in the restaurant after. Really nice friendly guy. I've heard from guys watching that he hit it pretty poor but his wedge game from inside 100 yards was ridiculously good. Aparrently Reed took a golf cart out. Living up to the "Fatrick" knickname!

 

All in all the town is buzzing and excitement is building!

 

Fatrick :haha:

[MattyO1984]

This time next Monday I will be down there strolling about, cannot wait!

[gvogel]

If TW can get his putting figured out, he will contend.

 

NOPE

 

hmmm yes, gtfo

 

Carnoustie will kill you if you can't keep your ball in play and in position, probably even more so if the ball is running. If Tiger can play a Hoylake type 1 iron game then he can contend - it's not a hard course to putt on, but you have to get to the green first....

 

I was watching tiger play at the Quicken Loans. He was not hitting his driving iron consistently straight. Those Hoylake days were a long time ago.

[Garush34]

This time next Monday I will be down there strolling about, cannot wait!

 

You there just the Monday? We're going on the Tuesday really looking forward to it. Been to Carnoustie many a time over the last few years for the Dunhill, excited to see it set up for the Open. Will be a completely different feel to it I'm sure.

[Superbrit]

I'm there Tuesday, really looking forward to it, should be a lot better than the Wednesday Practice day at Birkdale last year, bad weather forecast so barely anyone played.

 

This year should be very different

[Garush34]

I'm there Tuesday, really looking forward to it, should be a lot better than the Wednesday Practice day at Birkdale last year, bad weather forecast so barely anyone played.

 

This year should be very different

 

Yeah that's why we go Tuesday's, most of the guys will be there out and about somewhere on the course of the range. Best chance to see all the guys you want to see. Had to get there real early at Muirfield to try see Tiger, managed to catch up with him about the 6th/7th and watched for a few holes. Won't be there that early this year tho as the travel is further for us.