What up with Jordan?

[lowheel]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @straightshot7 said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > @disco111 said:

> > > > > > Well, it's the final round and as painfully usual, shoots himself out of it. Guess his game is all around solid for only 3 rounds at a time. He's won and won big before, so you really have to wonder, just what the heck is going on?

> > > > >

> > > > > He was never realistically in it. He was fine.

> > > >

> > > > Wasn't he tied to start the day with the guy that ended up winning by 2?

> > >

> > > I don’t think any sane person can expect a 64 or 63 out of him on Sunday yet.

> > >

> > > Cantlay has been due for a while. And even he didn’t get it done minus help from Kymer who was even for the day.

> >

> > Just saying he was tied to start the day with the guy who won. So to say Spieth was never realistically in it you must not believe in his ability to close or shoot a good final round.

> >

> > Calling a spade a spade, +1 is a bad Final round when you were -11 going into Sunday.

> >

> > In hindsight we can say he couldn't have kept up with Cantlay, but going into the round Spieth did have a realistic chance to win.

>

> Nah. I’m just saying he isn’t there yet. I didnt tune in expecting a win. I expected kymer to run and hide. Or Adam Scott to make every putt and win. Cantlay wasn’t even in my radar even though I know he’s been due. That guy just is hard to pull for.

 

Blade, I can tell you from a friend of mine who worked with Cantlays trainer when he was hurt hes a solid guy.His comeback story is alot like tigers. He thought he was done at 21 years old from a crippling back injury.The regimen he has to do to play now would blow you away. I know he has the happy feet shuffle/slow play in big spots but hes uber talented and really a humble good guy. He has major champion written all over him if he stays healthy. i know he doesnt have a TV personality but i really root for him.

[bladehunter]

> @lowheel said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > > @disco111 said:

> > > > > > > Well, it's the final round and as painfully usual, shoots himself out of it. Guess his game is all around solid for only 3 rounds at a time. He's won and won big before, so you really have to wonder, just what the heck is going on?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > He was never realistically in it. He was fine.

> > > > >

> > > > > Wasn't he tied to start the day with the guy that ended up winning by 2?

> > > >

> > > > I don’t think any sane person can expect a 64 or 63 out of him on Sunday yet.

> > > >

> > > > Cantlay has been due for a while. And even he didn’t get it done minus help from Kymer who was even for the day.

> > >

> > > Just saying he was tied to start the day with the guy who won. So to say Spieth was never realistically in it you must not believe in his ability to close or shoot a good final round.

> > >

> > > Calling a spade a spade, +1 is a bad Final round when you were -11 going into Sunday.

> > >

> > > In hindsight we can say he couldn't have kept up with Cantlay, but going into the round Spieth did have a realistic chance to win.

> >

> > Nah. I’m just saying he isn’t there yet. I didnt tune in expecting a win. I expected kymer to run and hide. Or Adam Scott to make every putt and win. Cantlay wasn’t even in my radar even though I know he’s been due. That guy just is hard to pull for.

>

> Blade, I can tell you from a friend of mine who worked with Cantlays trainer when he was hurt hes a solid guy.His comeback story is alot like tigers. He thought he was done at 21 years old from a crippling back injury.The regimen he has to do to play now would blow you away. I know he has the happy feet shuffle/slow play in big spots but hes uber talented and really a humble good guy. He has major champion written all over him if he stays healthy. i know he doesnt have a TV personality but i really root for him.

 

Yea. I told my wife of his story yesterday while they played 18. And I told her that i hated that I couldn’t muster any enthusiasm for the finish. Maybe in time that will change. I agree he’s Uber talented. He’d have to be.

[bladehunter]

> @lowheel said:

> > @Pent08 said:

> > Person A: "Spieth had another rough weekend, which is concerning considering his 2019 trend."

> > Person B: "He's fine, and who cares."

> > Person A: "Just thought it was interesting and important to note."

> > Person B: "He's improving, don't you see that!?!!?! Do you expect him to win everything?!?!"

> > Person A: "Ok..."

>

> Im fairly certain, if you go back like 4 months, i made the exact same point.Hes been elite thursday friday but when the pressure on the weekend comes his swing changes show hes not 100% confident. The difference now as compared to january -february is the big #s are disappearing and his birdies are up and the putter is heating up. Its easy to see that hes in the final phase of getting comfortable when in contention. I believe once the lid is taken off he'll climb and climb quickly to where he was.

 

 

Lol. The difference in that A and B person scenario is that In reality it was a combination of “ I told you the chicken wing boy was a fluke , he’s headed for the web.com t shirt trailer “. And person B simply called that fool out.

 

Now person A wants him to shoot 63 and win And do it now. lol. And person B ( still being sensible ) says not yet. In good time. Person A can’t make up his mind if the kid is a fluke or if he’s supposed to show up and shoot the lights out at jacks place. I’d say it’s impossible for both to be true.

[lowheel]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @lowheel said:

> > > @Pent08 said:

> > > Person A: "Spieth had another rough weekend, which is concerning considering his 2019 trend."

> > > Person B: "He's fine, and who cares."

> > > Person A: "Just thought it was interesting and important to note."

> > > Person B: "He's improving, don't you see that!?!!?! Do you expect him to win everything?!?!"

> > > Person A: "Ok..."

> >

> > Im fairly certain, if you go back like 4 months, i made the exact same point.Hes been elite thursday friday but when the pressure on the weekend comes his swing changes show hes not 100% confident. The difference now as compared to january -february is the big #s are disappearing and his birdies are up and the putter is heating up. Its easy to see that hes in the final phase of getting comfortable when in contention. I believe once the lid is taken off he'll climb and climb quickly to where he was.

>

>

> Lol. The difference in that A and B person scenario is that In reality it was a combination of “ I told you the chicken wing boy was a fluke , he’s headed for the web.com t shirt trailer “. And person B simply called that fool out.

>

> Now person A wants him to shoot 63 and win And do it now. lol. And person B ( still being sensible ) says not yet. In good time. Person A can’t make up his mind if the kid is a fluke or if he’s supposed to show up and shoot the lights out at jacks place. I’d say it’s impossible for both to be true.

 

Alot of people who havent played tournament golf let alone make swing changes and then try to play tournament golf with them will never understand the process. Tiger went through it a few times as well. you take 2 steps back to take 3 steps forward eventually but not always mind you. Youre right though, lots of monday morning quarter backs in here. I said it back in january/february that the weekends will be the toughest for him moving forward and they have been. his improvement though is noticeable. blade i agree though there is alot of veiled dislike for this guy and thats of course fair game but calling the guy a fluke and what not is just pure BS. i think hes a special player in the mold of Phil/Watson/Seve and dont see his fire going out soon. guys a a blood and guts player. Matter of time before he does it on the weekend

[straightshot7]

^Tiger never went 1 year in his prime (~1997-2009) without a win. Let alone almost 2 years.

 

Really not an apt comparison.

 

Spieth is coming up on 2 years without a win. You can't chalk it all up to swing changes. Swing changes gone terribly wrong maybe.

 

I think he's a great player but you guys make a lot of excuses for him.

[tsecor]

maybe Jordan peaked.....you see it quite often in sports.

[lowheel]

> @straightshot7 said:

> ^Tiger never went 1 year in his prime (~1997-2009) without a win. Let alone almost 2 years.

>

> Really not an apt comparison.

>

> Spieth is coming up on 2 years without a win. You can't chalk it all up to swing changes. Swing changes gone terribly wrong maybe.

>

> I think he's a great player but you guys make a lot of excuses for him.

 

jesus christ... nowhere did i make a Tiger Jordan comparison, thats a ridiculous comparison. I simply pointed out that it was tough for Tiger so its tough for lesser players. Im not making any excuses for Jordan just giving my observations on his swing evolution and struggles. You are correct not all of the winless streak is due to swing changes but a huge bit of it was and thats ok. he made the call to change and tweak and hes living by it. Its a huge risk but its his call.I dont like it because of the timing of it but again his call. Tiger won once in 14 months in 98 and once in 14 months 2004 when he made big changes. Not every one is Tiger and gets it done in that short period of time. I think ive been pretty blunt about his struggles but i also have eyes and see enough flashes to know its trending up. like blade, im not crazy about the flatter swing but maybe it works for him.

[Hankshank]

Does anyone know, has Spieth stated what he has actually been working on in his game the last couple of years? In his prime he was not straight from tee, seems to me that has become better, and that the putting was off last year. That would give the impression that he has had a lot of his focus on swing changes for a while now. To my unprofessional eye his swing looks better too. I can almost root for him now. But, has he stated what he has been working on?

[OldTomMorris]

He hit it all over the place at Memorial especially on the weekend but that course has some of the easiest fairways to hit on the PGA Tour. His short-game was insanely good, very impressive.

[bladehunter]

Never disappoint guys. “ he should have shot 64. He was only 4 back “. “ maybe he peaked .... “. “ this guys no goat “. Can’t you see the contradiction ?

[straightshot7]

> @lowheel said:

> > @straightshot7 said:

> > ^Tiger never went 1 year in his prime (~1997-2009) without a win. Let alone almost 2 years.

> >

> > Really not an apt comparison.

> >

> > Spieth is coming up on 2 years without a win. You can't chalk it all up to swing changes. Swing changes gone terribly wrong maybe.

> >

> > I think he's a great player but you guys make a lot of excuses for him.

>

> jesus christ... nowhere did i make a Tiger Jordan comparison, thats a ridiculous comparison. I simply pointed out that it was tough for Tiger so its tough for lesser players. Im not making any excuses for Jordan just giving my observations on his swing evolution and struggles. You are correct not all of the winless streak is due to swing changes but a huge bit of it was and thats ok. he made the call to change and tweak and hes living by it. Its a huge risk but its his call.I dont like it because of the timing of it but again his call. Tiger won once in 14 months in 98 and once in 14 months 2004 when he made big changes. Not every one is Tiger and gets it done in that short period of time. I think ive been pretty blunt about his struggles but i also have eyes and see enough flashes to know its trending up. like blade, im not crazy about the flatter swing but maybe it works for him.

 

Chill with the language.

 

I'm just pointing out that comparing Tiger's swing changes/struggles to Spieth's swing changes/struggles is apples to oranges. Tiger's longest streak of tournaments without a win, during the periods you mentioned: 15.

Spieth's current winless streak: 45

 

The "14 months" thing is only because of the off season time spent not playing any tournaments. Tiger never went a season without a win. Every time he went through a swing change period, he proceeded to obliterate everyone the following seasons:

 

1 win in 1998 followed by 8 wins in 1999 and 9 wins in 2000.

1 win in 2004 followed by 6 wins in 2005 and 8 wins in 2006.

 

Tiger never had a period in his prime where we questioned what was wrong with him. He rebounded quickly from swing changes and proceeded to dominate. Spieth on the other hand has admitted that the swing changes have gone wrong and now he is in a totally different territory. We are now wondering if he will ever recover, which was never the case with Tiger.

 

So comparing his swing struggles to Tiger's is really glass (half) full. I applaud you for your optimism. But we can just as accurately compare Spieth to Padraig Harrington and guys that never recovered from swing changes.

 

I get your point about everyone, even Tiger, struggles through swing changes. What I'm saying is that we are beyond that with Spieth. He's gone past the reasonable period of time for swing changes to qualify as an excuse. Now it's looking like something went seriously wrong or it's partially mental.

[lowheel]

> @straightshot7 said:

> > @lowheel said:

> > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > ^Tiger never went 1 year in his prime (~1997-2009) without a win. Let alone almost 2 years.

> > >

> > > Really not an apt comparison.

> > >

> > > Spieth is coming up on 2 years without a win. You can't chalk it all up to swing changes. Swing changes gone terribly wrong maybe.

> > >

> > > I think he's a great player but you guys make a lot of excuses for him.

> >

> > jesus christ... nowhere did i make a Tiger Jordan comparison, thats a ridiculous comparison. I simply pointed out that it was tough for Tiger so its tough for lesser players. Im not making any excuses for Jordan just giving my observations on his swing evolution and struggles. You are correct not all of the winless streak is due to swing changes but a huge bit of it was and thats ok. he made the call to change and tweak and hes living by it. Its a huge risk but its his call.I dont like it because of the timing of it but again his call. Tiger won once in 14 months in 98 and once in 14 months 2004 when he made big changes. Not every one is Tiger and gets it done in that short period of time. I think ive been pretty blunt about his struggles but i also have eyes and see enough flashes to know its trending up. like blade, im not crazy about the flatter swing but maybe it works for him.

>

> Chill with the language.

>

> I'm just pointing out that comparing Tiger's swing changes/struggles to Spieth's swing changes/struggles is apples to oranges. Tiger's longest streak of tournaments without a win, during the periods you mentioned: 15.

> Spieth's current winless streak: 45

>

> The "14 months" thing is only because of the off season time spent not playing any tournaments. Tiger never went a season without a win. Every time he went through a swing change period, he proceeded to obliterate everyone the following seasons:

>

> 1 win in 1998 followed by 8 wins in 1999 and 9 wins in 2000.

> 1 win in 2004 followed by 6 wins in 2005 and 8 wins in 2006.

>

> Tiger never had a period in his prime where we questioned what was wrong with him. He rebounded quickly from swing changes and proceeded to dominate. Spieth on the other hand has admitted that the swing changes have gone wrong and now he is in a totally different territory. We are now wondering if he will ever recover, which was never the case with Tiger.

>

> So comparing his swing struggles to Tiger's is really glass (half) full. I applaud you for your optimism. But we can just as accurately compare Spieth to Padraig Harrington and guys that never recovered from swing changes.

>

> I get your point about everyone, even Tiger, struggles through swing changes. What I'm saying is that we are beyond that with Spieth. He's gone past the reasonable period of time for swing changes to qualify as an excuse. Now it's looking like something went seriously wrong or it's partially mental.

 

its as if you didnt read what i wrote...

[bladehunter]

Can’t wait for next week !!

[rafal]

I am ready to throw in the towel honestly. Change caddy, swing, coach and divorce the wife. Whatever at this point. His rounds are exhausting to WATCH. The incessant talking and horrible hack shots. I can't take it.

[straightshot7]

> @lowheel said:

> > @straightshot7 said:

> > > @lowheel said:

> > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > ^Tiger never went 1 year in his prime (~1997-2009) without a win. Let alone almost 2 years.

> > > >

> > > > Really not an apt comparison.

> > > >

> > > > Spieth is coming up on 2 years without a win. You can't chalk it all up to swing changes. Swing changes gone terribly wrong maybe.

> > > >

> > > > I think he's a great player but you guys make a lot of excuses for him.

> > >

> > > jesus christ... nowhere did i make a Tiger Jordan comparison, thats a ridiculous comparison. I simply pointed out that it was tough for Tiger so its tough for lesser players. Im not making any excuses for Jordan just giving my observations on his swing evolution and struggles. You are correct not all of the winless streak is due to swing changes but a huge bit of it was and thats ok. he made the call to change and tweak and hes living by it. Its a huge risk but its his call.I dont like it because of the timing of it but again his call. Tiger won once in 14 months in 98 and once in 14 months 2004 when he made big changes. Not every one is Tiger and gets it done in that short period of time. I think ive been pretty blunt about his struggles but i also have eyes and see enough flashes to know its trending up. like blade, im not crazy about the flatter swing but maybe it works for him.

> >

> > Chill with the language.

> >

> > I'm just pointing out that comparing Tiger's swing changes/struggles to Spieth's swing changes/struggles is apples to oranges. Tiger's longest streak of tournaments without a win, during the periods you mentioned: 15.

> > Spieth's current winless streak: 45

> >

> > The "14 months" thing is only because of the off season time spent not playing any tournaments. Tiger never went a season without a win. Every time he went through a swing change period, he proceeded to obliterate everyone the following seasons:

> >

> > 1 win in 1998 followed by 8 wins in 1999 and 9 wins in 2000.

> > 1 win in 2004 followed by 6 wins in 2005 and 8 wins in 2006.

> >

> > Tiger never had a period in his prime where we questioned what was wrong with him. He rebounded quickly from swing changes and proceeded to dominate. Spieth on the other hand has admitted that the swing changes have gone wrong and now he is in a totally different territory. We are now wondering if he will ever recover, which was never the case with Tiger.

> >

> > So comparing his swing struggles to Tiger's is really glass (half) full. I applaud you for your optimism. But we can just as accurately compare Spieth to Padraig Harrington and guys that never recovered from swing changes.

> >

> > I get your point about everyone, even Tiger, struggles through swing changes. What I'm saying is that we are beyond that with Spieth. He's gone past the reasonable period of time for swing changes to qualify as an excuse. Now it's looking like something went seriously wrong or it's partially mental.

>

> its as if you didnt read what i wrote...

 

I read it. I'm just pointing out that bringing up Tiger's "struggles" with swing changes hurts your argument if anything.

 

Since even with the major changes Tiger made, he never went more than 15 tournaments without winning.

 

So Spieth's changes are clearly taking much much much longer to take effect, if that's really the problem.

 

I don't see what is not factual about that?

[lowheel]

> @rafal said:

> I am ready to throw in the towel honestly. Change caddy, swing, coach and divorce the wife. Whatever at this point. His rounds are exhausting to WATCH. The incessant talking and horrible hack shots. I can't take it.

 

 

[Barfolomew]

I'd love to coach Jordy's mental game... obviously no one else is

 

Toughen him up in all the right places...

[North Texas]

> @Barfolomew said:

> I'd love to coach Jordy's mental game... obviously no one else is

>

> Toughen him up in all the right places...

 

I'm a huge Jordan fan. I have no clue if I, or you, are right but that is exactly what I am thinking.

[bladehunter]

> @"North Texas" said:

> > @Barfolomew said:

> > I'd love to coach Jordy's mental game... obviously no one else is

> >

> > Toughen him up in all the right places...

>

> I'm a huge Jordan fan. I have no clue if I, or you, are right but that is exactly what I am thinking.

 

He’s going to have to get fed up. And decide to change his mindset. He’s simply self sabotaging his game at this point. Or at least he isn’t learning from his mental mistakes. It’s one thing to make bad swings etc. it’s entirely another to be struggling with course management issues.

[Krt22]

Gosh darn it, Jordan!

[gvogel]

When are you Jordan fans going to come to grips with the fact that the game has passed him by. I could tell you about Bill Rodgers, who played at the highest levels for a few years with a weak grip and a lack of distance. jordan played at an even higher level. But, ultimately, as Bill Rodgers found out, his lack of distance wore him out. Rodgers had a nice run from 1978 t0 1981.

 

Most really good major champions have a run of 4 or 5 years. Only the most gifted golfers have a run longer than that - and those guys have the gift of unnatural, and easy, length off the tee. Nicklaus, Jones, Snead, Hogan, even Tom Watson were very long drivers of the ball. They had staying power.

 

Jordan was a freak due to his single minded preparation and concentration. And other worldly putting for a few years. But he lacks the necessary huge talent that it takes to dominate this game for a long period of time.

 

You guys really need to get over your infatuation with Jordan Spieth. A fine golfer, and dominant for a short period. But probably not a factor going forward.

[gvogel]

OR you can go back to this parallel. Ben Crenshaw. He came out on the tour with average length and great putting prowess. He was the next big thing and won the Masters in 1984. Then he played well sporadically - I remember seeing him play in Canada on a satellite tour - winning an occasional tournament then and there and finished with a bang winning the Masters again in 1995. He didn't have the long game to put together with his brilliant putting to be the dominant major player that you all see in Jordan Spieth.

[bladehunter]

> @gvogel said:

> When are you Jordan fans going to come to grips with the fact that the game has passed him by. I could tell you about Bill Rodgers, who played at the highest levels for a few years with a weak grip and a lack of distance. jordan played at an even higher level. But, ultimately, as Bill Rodgers found out, his lack of distance wore him out. Rodgers had a nice run from 1978 t0 1981.

>

> Most really good major champions have a run of 4 or 5 years. Only the most gifted golfers have a run longer than that - and those guys have the gift of unnatural, and easy, length off the tee. Nicklaus, Jones, Snead, Hogan, even Tom Watson were very long drivers of the ball. They had staying power.

>

> Jordan was a freak due to his single minded preparation and concentration. And other worldly putting for a few years. But he lacks the necessary huge talent that it takes to dominate this game for a long period of time.

>

> You guys really need to get over your infatuation with Jordan Spieth. A fine golfer, and dominant for a short period. But probably not a factor going forward.

 

Lol. He’s far from a short knocker. Swing and miss.

[disco111]

According to PGA stats, Jordan is averaging 295 with the driver. So it seems that it's not that length that's holding him back. It's more likely that 3 to 4 inch length between his ears that's the problem..............

[cardoustie]

Timing based funkyish swing, he needs to find his old timing

He is so annoying to watch, goodness gracious as Gentle Ben used to say

[Mcgeeno]

This is a pretty easy question to answer IMO if people take their emotions out of it no matter which side of the love/hate side they are on.

 

"Whats wrong with Jordan?"

 

He doesnt hit it good enough to contend right now. Simple as that. He's below average from tee to green every week.

 

He's like 190th in driving accuracy. Middle of the pack in distance. All his approach stats put him below average (116th from 50-125, 107 from 200+) he's just not good enough from tee to green. Period.

 

 

[Shilgy]

> @gvogel said:

> OR you can go back to this parallel. Ben Crenshaw. He came out on the tour with average length and great putting prowess. He was the next big thing and won the Masters in 1984. Then he played well sporadically - I remember seeing him play in Canada on a satellite tour - winning an occasional tournament then and there and finished with a bang winning the Masters again in 1995. He didn't have the long game to put together with his brilliant putting to be the dominant major player that you all see in Jordan Spieth.

 

He was the next big thing out of college and won his first event on tour as I recall. He won 19 times on tour and is in the hall of fame. When did he ever play a satellite tour?

[oldmotor]

I think Jordan has become such a whiner, that everything is someone else’s fault. He needs to start owning up to his mistakes and move on.

No one likes a crybaby...

[lowheel]

> @straightshot7 said:

> > @lowheel said:

> > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > @lowheel said:

> > > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > ^Tiger never went 1 year in his prime (~1997-2009) without a win. Let alone almost 2 years.

> > > > >

> > > > > Really not an apt comparison.

> > > > >

> > > > > Spieth is coming up on 2 years without a win. You can't chalk it all up to swing changes. Swing changes gone terribly wrong maybe.

> > > > >

> > > > > I think he's a great player but you guys make a lot of excuses for him.

> > > >

> > > > jesus christ... nowhere did i make a Tiger Jordan comparison, thats a ridiculous comparison. I simply pointed out that it was tough for Tiger so its tough for lesser players. Im not making any excuses for Jordan just giving my observations on his swing evolution and struggles. You are correct not all of the winless streak is due to swing changes but a huge bit of it was and thats ok. he made the call to change and tweak and hes living by it. Its a huge risk but its his call.I dont like it because of the timing of it but again his call. Tiger won once in 14 months in 98 and once in 14 months 2004 when he made big changes. Not every one is Tiger and gets it done in that short period of time. I think ive been pretty blunt about his struggles but i also have eyes and see enough flashes to know its trending up. like blade, im not crazy about the flatter swing but maybe it works for him.

> > >

> > > Chill with the language.

> > >

> > > I'm just pointing out that comparing Tiger's swing changes/struggles to Spieth's swing changes/struggles is apples to oranges. Tiger's longest streak of tournaments without a win, during the periods you mentioned: 15.

> > > Spieth's current winless streak: 45

> > >

> > > The "14 months" thing is only because of the off season time spent not playing any tournaments. Tiger never went a season without a win. Every time he went through a swing change period, he proceeded to obliterate everyone the following seasons:

> > >

> > > 1 win in 1998 followed by 8 wins in 1999 and 9 wins in 2000.

> > > 1 win in 2004 followed by 6 wins in 2005 and 8 wins in 2006.

> > >

> > > Tiger never had a period in his prime where we questioned what was wrong with him. He rebounded quickly from swing changes and proceeded to dominate. Spieth on the other hand has admitted that the swing changes have gone wrong and now he is in a totally different territory. We are now wondering if he will ever recover, which was never the case with Tiger.

> > >

> > > So comparing his swing struggles to Tiger's is really glass (half) full. I applaud you for your optimism. But we can just as accurately compare Spieth to Padraig Harrington and guys that never recovered from swing changes.

> > >

> > > I get your point about everyone, even Tiger, struggles through swing changes. What I'm saying is that we are beyond that with Spieth. He's gone past the reasonable period of time for swing changes to qualify as an excuse. Now it's looking like something went seriously wrong or it's partially mental.

> >

> > its as if you didnt read what i wrote...

>

> I read it. I'm just pointing out that bringing up Tiger's "struggles" with swing changes hurts your argument if anything.

>

> Since even with the major changes Tiger made, he never went more than 15 tournaments without winning.

>

> So Spieth's changes are clearly taking much much much longer to take effect, if that's really the problem.

>

> I don't see what is not factual about that?

 

If youre repeating yourself then no you didnt read what i wrote. You seem very keen to keep doing it. Ill simply pass on repeating myself over and over.

[straightshot7]

> @lowheel said:

> > @straightshot7 said:

> > > @lowheel said:

> > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > @lowheel said:

> > > > > > @straightshot7 said:

> > > > > > ^Tiger never went 1 year in his prime (~1997-2009) without a win. Let alone almost 2 years.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Really not an apt comparison.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Spieth is coming up on 2 years without a win. You can't chalk it all up to swing changes. Swing changes gone terribly wrong maybe.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think he's a great player but you guys make a lot of excuses for him.

> > > > >

> > > > > jesus christ... nowhere did i make a Tiger Jordan comparison, thats a ridiculous comparison. I simply pointed out that it was tough for Tiger so its tough for lesser players. Im not making any excuses for Jordan just giving my observations on his swing evolution and struggles. You are correct not all of the winless streak is due to swing changes but a huge bit of it was and thats ok. he made the call to change and tweak and hes living by it. Its a huge risk but its his call.I dont like it because of the timing of it but again his call. Tiger won once in 14 months in 98 and once in 14 months 2004 when he made big changes. Not every one is Tiger and gets it done in that short period of time. I think ive been pretty blunt about his struggles but i also have eyes and see enough flashes to know its trending up. like blade, im not crazy about the flatter swing but maybe it works for him.

> > > >

> > > > Chill with the language.

> > > >

> > > > I'm just pointing out that comparing Tiger's swing changes/struggles to Spieth's swing changes/struggles is apples to oranges. Tiger's longest streak of tournaments without a win, during the periods you mentioned: 15.

> > > > Spieth's current winless streak: 45

> > > >

> > > > The "14 months" thing is only because of the off season time spent not playing any tournaments. Tiger never went a season without a win. Every time he went through a swing change period, he proceeded to obliterate everyone the following seasons:

> > > >

> > > > 1 win in 1998 followed by 8 wins in 1999 and 9 wins in 2000.

> > > > 1 win in 2004 followed by 6 wins in 2005 and 8 wins in 2006.

> > > >

> > > > Tiger never had a period in his prime where we questioned what was wrong with him. He rebounded quickly from swing changes and proceeded to dominate. Spieth on the other hand has admitted that the swing changes have gone wrong and now he is in a totally different territory. We are now wondering if he will ever recover, which was never the case with Tiger.

> > > >

> > > > So comparing his swing struggles to Tiger's is really glass (half) full. I applaud you for your optimism. But we can just as accurately compare Spieth to Padraig Harrington and guys that never recovered from swing changes.

> > > >

> > > > I get your point about everyone, even Tiger, struggles through swing changes. What I'm saying is that we are beyond that with Spieth. He's gone past the reasonable period of time for swing changes to qualify as an excuse. Now it's looking like something went seriously wrong or it's partially mental.

> > >

> > > its as if you didnt read what i wrote...

> >

> > I read it. I'm just pointing out that bringing up Tiger's "struggles" with swing changes hurts your argument if anything.

> >

> > Since even with the major changes Tiger made, he never went more than 15 tournaments without winning.

> >

> > So Spieth's changes are clearly taking much much much longer to take effect, if that's really the problem.

> >

> > I don't see what is not factual about that?

>

> If youre repeating yourself then no you didnt read what i wrote. You seem very keen to keep doing it. Ill simply pass on repeating myself over and over.

 

Nothing I'm saying is inaccurate.

 

I'm simply pointing out that if Spieth's problems are primarily swing related, they are taking much longer to sort out than other players have taken.

 

If Spieth knew that changing his swing would have resulted in a ~46 tournament winless streak, I don't think he would have done it.

 

Even he has expressed extreme frustration and admitted that he's essentially lost and having to re-learn how to play. In other words, this isn't a routine swing change that is on course for success. It's gone drastically wrong. The results show that.

 

But I'm sorry for trying to have a rational exchange with you. It's clearly not possible.