Tour Putter weight | Historical ave 340-350 ???

[drbonesvt]

Over the years watched threads like this and eBay for tour sticks , never seeing anything +350.   Curious to anyone that’s in the know 

 

1. With so many mallets in play, high MOI putters, is the ave weight gone up , So many spiders @ 355 or heavier I would think this is the case 

2.  Mallets aside, blade style putters, with the improvements in agronomy , have these followed suit in a heavier trend

 

Thx 

[A.Princey]

I still like a light putter for all speed type greens. I know this isn't a poll, but I think they got everything perfect about 2 decades ago with the 320-330g releases. My 2 cents...

[ColinKelvin]

I have five tour issue Pings made between 2003 and 2010.  They are all blades and are 360g, 365g, 368g, and two at 381g. 

 

I would imagine the vast majority of tour putters are over 350g, especially in the present day.

[drbonesvt]

2 hours ago, ColinKelvin said:

I have five tour issue Pings made between 2003 and 2010.  They are all blades and are 360g, 365g, 368g, and two at 381g. 

 

I would imagine the vast majority of tour putters are over 350g, especially in the present day.

Those tour issue pings aren’t easy to find, what models ?

[ColinKelvin]

Here they are; Anser G2i, Redwood Anser, Anser Milled, and Zing 5KSs in becu and SS.  The latter are the heaviest.

[kpt]

Beautiful collection there!

[ColinKelvin]

1 hour ago, kpt said:

Beautiful collection there!

Thanks - still building it!

[Fairway14]

7 hours ago, A.Princey said:

I still like a light putter for all speed type greens. I know this isn't a poll, but I think they got everything perfect about 2 decades ago with the 320-330g releases. My 2 cents...

 

Agreed !

[Fairway14]

On 12/1/2020 at 3:56 AM, drbonesvt said:

Over the years watched threads like this and eBay for tour sticks , never seeing anything +350.   Curious to anyone that’s in the know 

 

1. With so many mallets in play, high MOI putters, is the ave weight gone up , So many spiders @ 355 or heavier I would think this is the case 

2.  Mallets aside, blade style putters, with the improvements in agronomy , have these followed suit in a heavier trend

 

Thx 

 

Tiger's famous putter has a head weight of approximately 318 grams.

A 35" putter with a 330 gram head and a 58 gram grip has a swing weight of D6, which is reasonably well balanced yet still plenty heavy.

I think the 350 gram putter heads hurt more players putting than they help.

[ColinKelvin]

1 hour ago, Fairway14 said:

 

Tiger's famous putter has a head weight of approximately 318 grams.

A 35" putter with a 330 gram head and a 58 gram grip has a swing weight of D6, which is reasonably well balanced yet still plenty heavy.

I think the 350 gram putter heads hurt more players putting than they help.

I'm not a Scotty expert by any means but it has been reported elsewhere as 340-350g.  Interested in where the 318g comes from?

 

I love classic lighter putters too, even though I collect the tour ones with added weights and use the Milled Anser (or a JAS Wti model) most of the time.  I have a few old BeCu, BeNi and SS Pings which make guest appearances.

[Fairway14]

9 minutes ago, ColinKelvin said:

  Interested in where the 318g comes from?

 

 

 

Tiger's putter specs are 35.25" length, 58 gram grip, and D2 swing weight.  This means the putter head weight is approximately 318 grams.

In his junior days and most of his amateur career Tiger played a 315 gram Ping putter head.

[Newgs]

Here is an article from a few months ago that has Tiger's original putter head weight at 327 grams. New putter he was testing out when this article was written is believed to be heavier.

 

https://www.golfwrx.com/626180/tiger-woods-officially-using-new-scotty-cameron-putter-for-2020-pga-championship/

[Mustard_Tiger]

Most reputable articles about Tiger's putter report the head weight as being 326 gram originally. I have no idea if that's true.

 

I find attempts to calculate the head weight based on length, swingweight, grip weight, etc. to be suspect because it assumes two things that I don't know are facts: the overall length of the putter and the swingweight.

[PixlPutterman]

Dont forget he had those two big dots milled out, maybe took it from 328g down to 318g??

[nova6868]

I think the head weights have just gone up because of greens becoming faster. Even most pros seems to be in the 350-360 range now. The Spiders are mostly 355 as stated earlier. Of course it doesn't work for everyone, but most people seem to prefer slightly heavier on faster greens. 

 

For me it can definitely get too heavy though. Too heavy and I start to lose distance control on longer putts. 

[Medson]

Most people just take whatever OEMs give them at the retail. This is GolfWRX and does not represent a typical golfing consumer. 

 

Furthermore, "the heavier, the more stable" sells. I'm not sure if there is any scientific/empirical data behind this or it is just a marketing phrase. 

 

I found my preference fluctuates. 

[MattM97]

Hovland's Ping PLD putter is 360g so the average is for sure rising. 

[th6252]

Can't speak for others, but something to keep in mind is that there are a lot of us who are on the "shorter" side, and a lot more players are tending toward shorter putters as well.  At 5'8", I need to play my putter in the 33-33.5" range, so anything under ~355g feels too light and unbalanced for me.  My ideal weight is in the 365g range, give or take 5g.  If I were taller and used a 35" putter, I'm sure I'd be fine with 335-345g tops.

[MattM97]

28 minutes ago, th6252 said:

Can't speak for others, but something to keep in mind is that there are a lot of us who are on the "shorter" side, and a lot more players are tending toward shorter putters as well.  At 5'8", I need to play my putter in the 33-33.5" range, so anything under ~355g feels too light and unbalanced for me.  My ideal weight is in the 365g range, give or take 5g.  If I were taller and used a 35" putter, I'm sure I'd be fine with 335-345g tops.

 

I'm 6'3" and use a putter anywhere from 34.5 to 35.5" and for me anything under 350g is way too light, I'm happy at the 360g range. Now some people may freak out that the SW is insanely high but shouldn't really worry about SW on a putter.

[drbonesvt]

17 minutes ago, MattM97 said:

 

I'm 6'3" and use a putter anywhere from 34.5 to 35.5" and for me anything under 350g is way too light, I'm happy at the 360g range. Now some people may freak out that the SW is insanely high but shouldn't really worry about SW on a putter.

SS P = 2mph , hard transition 

[RichieHunt]

There's a lot of things to unpack here.  I've been thinking about this subject a lot lately and recently I purchased a custom blade putter with the weight at 330 grams which is abnormally light by today's standards.  

 

I think first and foremost, heavy heads aren't for everybody, but the same goes for light heads.  My serious, high level competitive golf was mostly in the 90's and that was when I putted my best.  Yes, I did practice putting far more then, but to me I putted best with lighter and simpler putters and got worse when the putters became heavier and more face balanced with millings and inserts, etc.  

 

The putter I putted best with was a Wilson 8802 that I bought in 1990.  I'm guessing the headweight was between 310-325 grams, but it never felt light to me at all.  Unfortunately, somebody stole it from my bag and without the Neumann leather paddle grip and that shaft, the replacements never felt the same.  Plus, that's when I started to get more into heavier putters and more of a SBST stroke.  I had a Ram Zebra that had a lot of weight (you could take out the sole plate and add washers as weights to the head).  I could make a lot of long putts with that thing, but I ended up getting very yippy with it.

 

But for the most part, back then putter heads weighed in the 310-330 gram weight range.  

 

Now a blade is pretty much in the 350-380 gram range.  Piretti makes their heads very heavy.  Then you see people with say a 370 gram head with a counterweight in the grip so they have a 120 gram grip as well.  

 

One of my friends believes that the heavier head weights started with Scotty Cameron because of the Japanese market where the Japanese utilize shorter length putters and they would come with heavier heads to not make them too light.  

 

I personally wonder if it's more people moving towards the feel of face balanced putters and counter balanced putters as well. Along with for a time people using anchored putters, armlock as well as saw grips, etc.   And maybe the softer heads are playing a roll in that as well.

 

I do remember years ago the general consensus from putting instructors and fitters was that you should increase the head weight for faster greens and lighten the head for slower greens.  I can't say I ever quite bought into that theory.

 

But I can tell you that it's practically impossible to find a blade head these days that is under 350 grams.  I searched everywhere for something in the the 330-340 gram range recently and my best option was either to take a woman's putter or a junior putter although those were too light.  That's why I decided to get a custom built option.

 

 

 

 

 

RH

[Fairway14]

49 minutes ago, RichieHunt said:

There's a lot of things to unpack here. 

 

The heavy heads came about 20 years ago when some companies started making broomstick length putters. Once the heavy heads were produced and available, people started cutting down the shaft lengths from broomstick length to 35" and they liked that (due to the heavy head) a mishit sounded/ felt better with a 350 gram head compared to a 315 gram head. Remember that as heads get heavier from 350 to 360 to 370 etc... the impact sound/feel becomes the same whether it was a well struck putt or a mishit.

For about 15 years Scotty Cameron maintained his conviction that 33/350, 34/340 and 35"/330 gram putters were well balanced, appropriate.

But other brands kept offering 35"350 heads so Cameron eventually threw in the towel and abandoned his previous convictions.

These days what's sold at retail is 350 to 370 gram heads with super heavy grips (to counter balance the heavy head weight) , and the end result is a sledgehammer.

[th6252]

14 hours ago, MattM97 said:

 

I'm 6'3" and use a putter anywhere from 34.5 to 35.5" and for me anything under 350g is way too light, I'm happy at the 360g range. Now some people may freak out that the SW is insanely high but shouldn't really worry about SW on a putter.

I actually do tend toward putters on the heavier side so you're sort of preaching to the choir lol.  I like to go into the 370+ range to smooth out my stroke when it really gets out of whack, but admittedly, speed control does suffer some when I go too heavy.

[th6252]

14 hours ago, RichieHunt said:

There's a lot of things to unpack here.  I've been thinking about this subject a lot lately and recently I purchased a custom blade putter with the weight at 330 grams which is abnormally light by today's standards.  

 

I think first and foremost, heavy heads aren't for everybody, but the same goes for light heads.  My serious, high level competitive golf was mostly in the 90's and that was when I putted my best.  Yes, I did practice putting far more then, but to me I putted best with lighter and simpler putters and got worse when the putters became heavier and more face balanced with millings and inserts, etc.  

 

The putter I putted best with was a Wilson 8802 that I bought in 1990.  I'm guessing the headweight was between 310-325 grams, but it never felt light to me at all.  Unfortunately, somebody stole it from my bag and without the Neumann leather paddle grip and that shaft, the replacements never felt the same.  Plus, that's when I started to get more into heavier putters and more of a SBST stroke.  I had a Ram Zebra that had a lot of weight (you could take out the sole plate and add washers as weights to the head).  I could make a lot of long putts with that thing, but I ended up getting very yippy with it.

 

But for the most part, back then putter heads weighed in the 310-330 gram weight range.  

 

Now a blade is pretty much in the 350-380 gram range.  Piretti makes their heads very heavy.  Then you see people with say a 370 gram head with a counterweight in the grip so they have a 120 gram grip as well.  

 

One of my friends believes that the heavier head weights started with Scotty Cameron because of the Japanese market where the Japanese utilize shorter length putters and they would come with heavier heads to not make them too light.  

 

I personally wonder if it's more people moving towards the feel of face balanced putters and counter balanced putters as well. Along with for a time people using anchored putters, armlock as well as saw grips, etc.   And maybe the softer heads are playing a roll in that as well.

 

I do remember years ago the general consensus from putting instructors and fitters was that you should increase the head weight for faster greens and lighten the head for slower greens.  I can't say I ever quite bought into that theory.

 

But I can tell you that it's practically impossible to find a blade head these days that is under 350 grams.  I searched everywhere for something in the the 330-340 gram range recently and my best option was either to take a woman's putter or a junior putter although those were too light.  That's why I decided to get a custom built option.

 

 

 

 

 

RH

Nice post. 

I believe Scotty and maybe Toulon/Odyssey(possibly even Ping Vault 2) are you're only options really to get a sub 350 blade.  But yeah, as far as non-adjustable weight putters, sub 350 is seemingly non-existent these days...good for shorties like me though 😝

[PixlPutterman]

Most blades with weights are sub 250g when you take the weights out and leave them out lol

[MaineMariner]

Are there any modern OTR putters available in the 320-340 gram range?

 

I know that the new-old Pings that you can get from Morton's are the standard Ping headweights (300-315ish?). Some SeeMore putters are 340, I believe. I'm guessing you can probably swap some weights around in some cases to get pretty low. Still, if you walk into a golf shop carrying 2020 putters, it's probably impossible to find one that weights 330 grams.

[Scotty1140]

8 hours ago, MaineMariner said:

Are there any modern OTR putters available in the 320-340 gram range?

 

I know that the new-old Pings that you can get from Morton's are the standard Ping headweights (300-315ish?). Some SeeMore putters are 340, I believe. I'm guessing you can probably swap some weights around in some cases to get pretty low. Still, if you walk into a golf shop carrying 2020 putters, it's probably impossible to find one that weights 330 grams.

The blades in Cameron’s Special Select line weigh in the low mid 280g’s without the sole weights installed. That’s gives you a lot of options for a lighter head. 

Edited December 9, 2020 by Scotty1140

[wildcatden]

I own several Hoganardi BHB5-SS putters. Two of them are used and both heads weighed 329g and 330g respectively. I have another BHB5-SS that is brand new and never putted on the course.  Prior to the BHB5's I had played Ping BZ5 putters (circa early 2000's) with headweight around 300-310g. My putting was never that great.  Once I moved to the heavier head on the BHB5, putting improved dramatically.  Hard to say what drove that though? The weight? The softer feel? Subconscious confidence?

 

With tour pros moving to heavier weights, it appears that there is something to it and probably related to today's agronomy.  However, putting is so personal that the only way to get the best out of your putting is to experiment.

 

 

[T-MAC]

Personally, I lose my feel / distance control when the putter is too heavy.  I have several in the 350+g weight but my favorites are in the 340g range.
As to the theory of using a heavy head on fast greens and a lighter head on slower greens, I'm actually the exact opposite.  If the greens are running slow I want more weight / bulk behind the ball and when I'm playing slick greens I have much better feel / control with a lighter head.
As far as Tiger's putter, he did ask Scotty to make it light(er) than usual, which is why Scotty drilled out the dots in the cavity and the face.  Tiger was used to the lighter Ping putters he used in his early years.  From what I've read in the past, Tiger's Cameron was made in the 325g range but it was refinished a few times over the years and lost some weight.  I believe Tiger counters that with lead tape now and is afraid of having it refinished again.  He also had a Scotty with removeable weights that he will pull out once in awhile on slower greens.  I've even seen him put lead tape in the cavity as well as on the sole when he wants to beef up the weight on slower greens.

Edited December 13, 2020 by T-MAC

[golfluvzme]

I have to put my own personal preference on my 34" putter, in the 335-340 gram range.  Is that light?  By some standards, yes. 

Threads like these are fun to read.  Most everyone understands that there is no hard/fast rule when it comes to weight, but we all have our preferences.  In my experiences, Scotty's that are built with one weight in the heel and one in the toe, weigh more in the range of 325 grams, when the weights are removed.  Seeing that comment at 250 grams, then 285 sort of took me by surprise.  It may have changed in the recent years, but it was never that light, when only dealing with two weights in the sole.

A friend of mine makes putters for a living and told me that he had only made two putters for tour players over the past 15 years that were over 350 grams.  One was for a Champions Tour player who wanted 435 grams at 35".....THAT had to be a sledgehammer, but the player felt it quieted his hands.  Who is out there to argue with a player who makes his living with his golf clubs? 

Its fun to read all of the thoughts, but I'll stick with a little lighter than normal flat stick and enjoy the feel of a well-struck putt..........on the rare occasion that I find the green grass.

Keep sharing your thoughts, it makes for good reading!

LaMont in AZ