How Much Stronger Will Irons Become?

[WristySwing]

I have no loft cut off. If I maintain my distance gaps and hit the ball what I expect given my ball speed and see a desired flight window and launch and spin, I am good.

[Titleist_PT23]

I still wouldn't care. I need matching irons from around 24 degrees to something in the low 50s. Right now, it's called 5-SW. If I get a 2020 model iron, it will likely be 6-SW. I could buy an set of Blueprints or 620 MBs and it will be 4-PW (need to find some other GW/SW). My view is that you could make it 1-iron to 8-iron or W1 - W8.

I just go back to a 5-iron was 28-29 degrees (look at Tiger's specs or Adam Scotts 680s). Nearly everyone here would be OK with a 26-27 degree 5-iron and I'd bet lots of people play 23-24 degree 5-irons (which is really an old Strong 4-iron). They only reason why this is OK is because that's what people are using and they need to justify their decision. There's no fundamental proof or reason why strengthening a 5-iron 4-6 degrees is "acceptable" while strengthening a 6-iron 10+ degrees is not.

As mentioned, I do agree that the < 3 degree gaps at the top end are basically useless for most of the buyers of these clubs (with these types of lofts). As for the gaps on the bottom end, generally 4-5 degrees is probably better. But for years I played 47-54-60 and did just fine. I think Spieth goes 46-52 (WOW 6 DEGREES - HOW DOES HE MANAGE), Tiger is stated at 49-56 (7 DEGREEES), and Phil has a PW of god knows what and then 54-60 (COULD EASILY HAVE TWO GAPS OF 6 DEGREES!).

[Valtiel]

I suppose I could maybe care this much if somehow every iron set became like this and traditionalists were forced to change, but thats not the case so I have a hard time understanding what sounds like seething outrage towards something that doesn't actually impact you. And like @WristySwing implied, most all of the people I have seen with these jacked up sets are simply trying to keep the distance they are losing in old/older age, not people looking to brag about gaining some arbitrary amount of yardage. And why is energy even being wasted on caring about how far someone else hits a ball? Especially since the only real place people get all egoic about that kind of thing is off the tee, and jacked loft irons aren't magically making their drivers go any further.

[WristySwing]

Gosh darn it man! Imagine instead of buying 4-PW stamped on the bottom you have to buy 6-GW2! How will the golf community survive such a tragedy? @agolf1

[BlackDiamondPar5]

Have handicaps fallen in the last 10 years? I still say most of this is hype to sell clubs.

[EmperorPenguin]

I don't think so. Average handicap--legitimate or otherwise--is still at 16.5?

[Red4282]

At the very least, it just makes it even more confusing, just like in everything else In the golf equipment world, no standardization. Should be mandatory to print lofts on every club, just for sake of clarity.

[bubbagump]

Keep noticing some referencing this ego driven golfer, that lives for notifying you hes hitting a club or two less than you on every shot. Like somebody said, the majority of guys Ive noticed playing stronger lofted clubs are older guys just trying to keep pace with the course and not some flat brim wearing, speaker blaring, f boy. Lofts are subjective and work differently for everybody, why the intense focus on how its a bad trend? Just walk past those clubs and select whats best for your game lol.....just as the dude who picked the 38* pw did. Who cares

[SubaruWRX]

 

Saw this in another thread.

[Nessism]

I know one thing, I won't buy a set with a GW2. My line is drawn at a 44 degree PW (where I can bend to 45.) You do what you want though.

[BlackDiamondPar5]

Have never seen it be a bragging thing but certainly it doesn't hurt validating someone's purchase to themselves. "oh these new clubs are awesome I'm almost 2 clubs longer than my old set."

 

Don't get me wrong, at some point a guy needs to get new irons, but adding yardage because the new models are so much longer wouldn't be a reason.

 

 

[Zen_Golfer]

I think theyve reached the limit. Ive got a set of Tommy Armour Atomics that are some of the strongest lofted irons there are and I see that with the newer 845 model, TA went weaker on the lofts. The PW on the 845s is 43.5 degrees, which is about 2 degrees weaker than the Atomics are.

I know that for me, as someone who is not a long-hitter and who falls right in the middle of the range for regular flex shafts, with my Atomics, I cant hit anything longer than the 6-iron and all I carry is the 7-iron, the 9-iron and the AW. I do carry a 4-hybrid that is 21* but I find the 4 and 5 irons to be almost unusable for me and the 6-iron can be a struggle to get up in the air at times because the lofts are so strong.

I honestly hope that manufacturers dont go any stronger than 44 degrees for PW in the future because my 41 degree PW is kind of joke. Thats why I carry the 46* AW from my set instead of the PW.

[DaveGoodrich]

Totally agree with this. The "horse is out of the barn" as far as needing one gap wedge. Even at that, we have a gap wedge that is appropriate for "pitching" and a pitching wedge that most people only use as a "10 iron" from the fairway (not for "pitching"). Just for logical consistency, IMO, if a club has a name, it should do what the name says (lob, sand, pitch). If its intended for full swings, it should have a number (i.e. not GW2). Needing a gap wedge to fill the gap between your gap wedge and your pitching wedge is ridiculous.

[HuskyFan]

Why is it that you never see threads about guys bragging about how far they hit their strong lofted iron, yet always see threads about the guys playing traditional lofts complaining about said guys with strong lofted irons.

[Carolina Golfer 2]

I respect your knowledge and no doubt it is an extreme range. I just don't see what all the uproar is about. The cry for clubs to be made the way they were 10,20 and 30 years ago to me is not taking advantage of technology.

But in the end players should work with a qualified and knowledgea fitter to find the set and makeup that will help them. Obviously it won't be the same for everyone.

[Nels55]

Yes, but it is not taking advantage of technology to take a club with a 50 degree loft and stamp gap wedge 3 or whatever on it instead of pitching wedge. Do you see what I mean? Every set of iron clubs has a loft progression usually 4 degrees and a similar lofts for the clubs. Changing the number stamped on he head from 5 to 7 has nothing to do with technology. It is all marketing and nothing else.

LOL I happen to like having hopped up irons because psychologically it makes me feel good to be able to hit my seven iron 5 iron distance. It keeps me from over swinging. In reality the whole loft jacking movement is abject stupidity...

[OrangeGravy]

I think the only issue is that most people know how far they hit their PW, but don't know if it's 40*, 45*, or 48*. If you hand them a different club with W or P or PW on it and it doesn't go the same distance as theirs, they would have no clue as to why that happened. They only issue I even mildly have with it, is it's clearly used to mislead the average golf equipment consumer who isn't even aware that lofts are different from model to model. When I first started playing back in the 80's- 90's, I had no clue shaft stiffness ratings were different from OEM to OEM. I just assumed that a stiff shaft, was a stiff shaft, was a stiff shaft. I figured there must be an industry standard or they would use some other specific term to differentiate between OEM's.

[Red4282]

Yep very little standardization in the golf world. Would love to see lofts stamped even if tiny somewhere on the clubs. Wont happen tho.

[OrangeGravy]

I have yet to come across an iron that reaches a peak height, higher than my old Ping Eye 2 or Ping Zings and there's not much "tech" in those.

[rainkingjr]

I pretty have given up on caring about the jacked loft stuff. It got out of hand a long time ago with the nonsense marketing. Yes, there are plenty of people out their with ego issues who love to brag about hitting their 30 degree 7 irons 185 yards. Whatever makes them feel good about themselves. Bottom line is it's still a 30 degree loft whether it's stamped 5,6, or 7.

I wish the industry would have standardized a long time ago, not only with lofts, but with shaft flexes as well using CPM's and a reference. As someone else has stated, that horse has left the barn.

 

 

[cristphoto]

This is why I love my Ping i200's. Granted they are a touch stronger than irons from 15 years ago but the 4 and 5 iron in the set are actually 1 degree weaker to balance the distances and trajectories with the rest of the set. Plus only 1 gap wedge in the set. When you start seeing 3 gap wedges then you know the companies are getting crazy.

[WristySwing]

I think @HuskyFan is right here. There are far more people complaining about people bragging about hitting their new irons 10,20,30,40 yards longer than I have ever seen actual posts about. Case in point in this above post. I think there are at least 4 or 5 complaints in this thread and only 1 person saying they did gain yardage --- but don't really care. Should we take their handicap away and ban them from all golf because they are now enjoying themselves a bit more than they were before?

[Red4282]

Most of this disdain i see is towards the manufacturers and not the people playing them. When people start spreading mistruths about equipment, thats when it boils over.

[rainkingjr]

It just gets goofy at times. I've play with guys who gush over their distances with strong lofted irons. It's just sad to see people drinking the kool-aid that the manufacturers serve up. I feel like the OEMs do more damage to the average golfer than good. Take drivers as a prime example when they went past 45" standard lengths. Broke my heart to see Titleist go 45.5 with the TS. Mizuno is the last hold-out

[EmperorPenguin]

I checked the Mizuno lofts on their JPX-919 irons. Their pitching wedge is 46 degrees and the longest iron they have is a 3 iron at 23 degrees. Those specs are almost twenty years old, about two degrees stronger than the specs from about the 1990's, which I like (48-degree PW). Do the Japanese companies use the weaker lofts?

Are there any sets I can buy today with weaker lofts?

[BiggErn]

They make loft/lie machines and you can bend them to whatever you want. Or you can fill in the number on the bottom with some Jb weld or epoxy and write whatever number you want on the bottom with a sharpie.

[Red4282]

Mizuno is one of the last who is trying to hold ground, although their sets are a bit spread... 5 degree increments from 50-30. 50,45,40,35,30 in the hotmetal jpx line. I play the jpx tour. My pw is 46, but my 7 iron is 34. So while the pw is only one degree off the HMP, the 7 iron has 4 more degrees of loft. Thats some serious gaps, or would be for anyone with speed. Maybe the thinking is slower speeds will have smaller gaps.

[WristySwing]

Most of the strong lofts these day come from the Japanese sets. It is rare, unless you are buying a fully traditional CB/MB from a JDM brand, to get anything resembling 47-48* PW. All of their GI irons are pretty typically 5i at 22*-PW at 42/43*. Your player's distance JDM sets will be 23* 5i and 44/45* PW. I agree with the above, find a set with low bounce and bend weak to your hearts content. Or shell out the big money to Kyoei/Miura/Epon in Japan or National Custom and Artisan in the US and buy a forging house blank and get it done exactly as you want.

[ChaosTheory]

Yeah, I'm not buying it. Haven't seen it personally anyway. What I see is loft for loft, irons go about the same. Now, if they jack the loft but keep the same head weight and shaft length as that loft had before, then I'm good with it. ie Just changing the club number. But if they go from a 38" 27 degree club to a 37 or 37.5" 27 degree club, they haven't done me any good, they've actually hurt my speed and launch. I play better with weaker lofts at given lengths.

Lately I've gone with a 4 iron weakened to 25, no 5 iron, and 6 iron at 30, 7 iron 35. Then 4 degrees after that. The 3 degree thing on the longer end is nonsense. So too is 5 degrees from 7 iron on down. It's all a bad joke on us.

[cristphoto]

Ping offers three sets of lofts in their irons. Todays "standard" lofts, a power loft option where the clubs are strengthened a bit, and a traditional loft which is where irons were many years ago. So in the i210 for example a 7 iron could be 33 degrees (standard), 31.5 degrees (power loft), or 35 traditional retro loft.