Bryson not happy about being put on the clock...

[RickK]

> @SNIPERBBB said:

> I can see having some debate when the wind is swirling around or picking up and laying down. I like the quote from Jack on saturday on I think it was either Speith or Thomas(never really saw who it was) talking with their caddy and he said that "that was more conversation with a caddy then I would of had all year with mine". Even the first round or two of a tournament you ought to have a good idea what your good idea on what your doing before you get to the ball even if it was your first time on the course.

 

I remember seeing Jack on Feherty a while back and there was discussion about interaction with caddies. I remember that his remark went something like this...I wanted my caddie to be aware of the 3 ups. Show up, keep up, shut up.

 

[DrivingChamp]

He is painfully slow

[Golfjack]

Yeah let's not talk about my slow play but what about those slow walkers! They're like zombies out there! I always twiddle my thumbs all the way through them hitting the ball. Gotta make sure I work those thumbs well.

[MattyO1984]

Bryson might not be happy at being put on the clock, does he consider how happy everyone having to sit or stand and watch him will be?!

[Awsi Dooger]

> @JonnyKrasnodar said:

> Begs the question of what him and his caddy are doing while "waiting" on others to play. What takes 40 seconds to figure out God only knows. Still, at the women's event at the weekend Catriona Matthew tweeted that it was over 3 hours for 9 holes. Ridiculous.

 

That was brutal. It took 3 hours 10 minutes for the front nine. Then the USGA gave an arbitrary slow play penalty to an amateur, just to pretend they were doing something and that they hadn't caused the problems themselves. The amateur was in tears and the rules official was gesturing his arms in the cart trying to justify the decision.

 

Slow play should be named after DeChambeau. Actually I think the gallery should be allowed to march out there and confront him every time he moves his alignment mark on the green. How many 1/256th of an inch adjustments can you make in one round?

 

 

 

 

[Bad9]

Bryson should just shut up and speed the (*&k up

[QuigleyDU]

> @JonnyKrasnodar said:

> Begs the question of what him and his caddy are doing while "waiting" on others to play. What takes 40 seconds to figure out God only knows. Still, at the women's event at the weekend Catriona Matthew tweeted that it was over 3 hours for 9 holes. Ridiculous.

 

Are you surprised?? Have you ever gone out to play to find its "ladies day"? That, plus the demographics I am surprised the LPGA can even complete rounds each day.

[QuigleyDU]

> @MIgolfer20 said:

> there should be a hard time limit. 4.5 hours or 270 minutes for the round which averages 15 minutes per hole. U should get a little more time for par 5s and a little less for par 3s. if u don't make the turn in 135 minutes u get penalized a stroke. u dont finish in 270 minutes then 2 stroke penalty. I guarantee u they will find a way to finish on time.

 

you need to reverse the times for par 5 and 3. All backups and bottlenecks at golf courses happen on par 3s.

[Z1ggy16]

Do most pro's not play "ready golf" as in, as soon as they get to the ball, (while waiting for the green to clear) they are getting the distance, checking the wind, planning where the ball needs to land, where the miss(es) is, etc? When I go play, I find my ball, laser/GPS my distance, check wind, pick club. Takes about 15 seconds.

 

I can understand when you have a delicate chip/pitch or a testy down hill putt, but a normal approach shot should not be putting you on the clock. BAD's only counter I saw on Instagram was "this is my livelihood" but come on, you're a pro golfer. Do you really need 60 seconds to decide how to hit a 160 yard 8i with 2mph wind? Even little putts he seems to check quite a bit.

 

I gotta think this is not the norm - At the PGA I sat on 16 green for almost 4 hours... As soon as the green cleared, about 80% of the time the next ball was landing on the green within 30 seconds... Sometimes faster. I know a few players did take painfully long to hit the shot, but most of those guys were in the thiiiiick rough and were probably planning more for a miss than anything else. Problem is just a few guys can slow down a whole tournament.

 

Personally, I like to play as fast as possible. Any round going over 4hours starts to annoy me. Any 9 holes that takes longer than 2 hours is unacceptable. I know my game and I'm no pro, I don't debate clubs... I check behind the hole on some putts but only ones that don't seem obvious. Otherwise I'm just looking to 2 putt anything outside 10ft. On the slow muni greens, just wack something in the general direction of the hole and get speed right... tough to not come within 4-5 feet for your clean up putt.

[GoGoErky]

> @"Awsi Dooger" said:

> > @JonnyKrasnodar said:

> > Begs the question of what him and his caddy are doing while "waiting" on others to play. What takes 40 seconds to figure out God only knows. Still, at the women's event at the weekend Catriona Matthew tweeted that it was over 3 hours for 9 holes. Ridiculous.

>

> That was brutal. It took 3 hours 10 minutes for the front nine. Then the USGA gave an arbitrary slow play penalty to an amateur, just to pretend they were doing something and that they hadn't caused the problems themselves. The amateur was in tears and the rules official was gesturing his arms in the cart trying to justify the decision.

>

> Slow play should be named after DeChambeau. Actually I think the gallery should be allowed to march out there and confront him every time he moves his alignment mark on the green. How many 1/256th of an inch adjustments can you make in one round?

>

>

>

>

 

It wasn’t arbitrary. They followed the rules and just like Bryson she was warned/put on the clock and continued to be slow and out of position. All she had to do was game the system like everyone does. Speed up, get back on pace and off the clock. Then go back to your normal slow play. If it happens again repeat the steps.

 

[JaNelson38]

In all seriousness...I bet most everyone who complains about "slow play" would think again about it if there is the type of money attached to every shot like there is on the PGA Tour.

 

There are slow players on Tour. But its actually not that many. And its not as big of a deal as some people make it out to be. I still maintain, as Ive said in another thread, that the length of rounds on the PGA Tour (especially Thursday and Friday) is the sheer amount of golfers on the course at the same time. All it takes is one wayward shot or one time where you need a ruling for the entire timing sequence to be thrown out of whack for the entire wave.

 

I watched the NCAA Tournament Match Play on TV, and in my opinion there truly wasnt much difference between that and a PGA Tour event with regards to the time between shots. Just as much conversing, strategy, etc. There's just a ton of difference between playing golf for recreation and playing as your job. People think that just because they can play their 6000 yard muni track in 3.5 hours from a cart means PGA Tour pros who play for six figures every week are supposed to walk and play a 7300 yard course in 4 hours or less. Its absurd to think that way.

[davep043]

> @GoGoErky said:

>

> It wasn’t arbitrary. They followed the rules and just like Bryson she was warned/put on the clock and continued to be slow and out of position. All she had to do was game the system like everyone does. Speed up, get back on pace and off the clock. Then go back to your normal slow play. If it happens again repeat the steps.

>

An interesting tidbit from one of her playing partners from this article:

https://golfweek.com/2019/06/02/golf-amateur-andrea-lee-penalized-slow-play-u-s-womens-open/

> “They do start timing you as soon as the player reaches the ball. That’s the reason why you see a lot of caddies run ahead off the tee once players are on the clock to get the number and have the number ready by the time the player gets to the ball. The amateur, obviously, they’re not used to it.

 

>“Like Andrea in this case, she gets the number herself. So if she gets to the ball and they start timing her as soon as she gets there, I think it’s very hard to stay within the time limit getting the number and hitting the shot. I think that’s why they get in trouble.”

Professionals learn how to buy themselves an extra few seconds, even while on the clock. The amateur didn't, and paid the price.

 

[jimb6golf]

BAD just needs to speed up, along with a lot of other players (re: J Day, P Cantlay, etc.). The PGA needs to enforce the penalty for slow play not just put them on the clock. Instead of standing there waiting for your playing partner to hit, start working thru your preshot routine and calcs and then get on with it. Watching Cantlay shuffle back and forth over the weekend was horrible - even my wife said 'what is he doing, he looks silly'. I think even the networks are now starting to switch over to these horribly slow players later to avoid watching their silly preshot routines for too long (even the announcers were commenting on it this past weekend too).

[davep043]

> @jimb6golf said:

> BAD just needs to speed up, along with a lot of other players (re: J Day, P Cantlay, etc.). The PGA needs to enforce the penalty for slow play not just put them on the clock. Instead of standing there waiting for your playing partner to hit, start working thru your preshot routine and calcs and then get on with it. Watching Cantlay shuffle back and forth over the weekend was horrible - even my wife said 'what is he doing, he looks silly'. I think even the networks are now starting to switch over to these horribly slow players later to avoid watching their silly preshot routines for too long (even the announcers were commenting on it this past weekend too).

 

I'm not sure the officials aren't enforcing the policy, its just that the policy makes it extremely tough to actually penalize someone a stroke.

[QuigleyDU]

> @davep043 said:

> > @GoGoErky said:

> >

> > It wasn’t arbitrary. They followed the rules and just like Bryson she was warned/put on the clock and continued to be slow and out of position. All she had to do was game the system like everyone does. Speed up, get back on pace and off the clock. Then go back to your normal slow play. If it happens again repeat the steps.

> >

> An interesting tidbit from one of her playing partners from this article:

> https://golfweek.com/2019/06/02/golf-amateur-andrea-lee-penalized-slow-play-u-s-womens-open/

> > “They do start timing you as soon as the player reaches the ball. That’s the reason why you see a lot of caddies run ahead off the tee once players are on the clock to get the number and have the number ready by the time the player gets to the ball. The amateur, obviously, they’re not used to it.

>

> >“Like Andrea in this case, she gets the number herself. So if she gets to the ball and they start timing her as soon as she gets there, I think it’s very hard to stay within the time limit getting the number and hitting the shot. I think that’s why they get in trouble.”

> Professionals learn how to buy themselves an extra few seconds, even while on the clock. The amateur didn't, and paid the price.

>

 

always singling out the am's. Its a safe way to go. All royalty are familiar with whipping boys.

[gvogel]

> @SNIPERBBB said:

>** I can see having some debate when the wind is swirling around or picking up and laying down**. I like the quote from Jack on saturday on I think it was either Speith or Thomas(never really saw who it was) talking with their caddy and he said that "that was more conversation with a caddy then I would of had all year with mine". Even the first round or two of a tournament you ought to have a good idea what your good idea on what your doing before you get to the ball even if it was your first time on the course.

 

This is a pet peeve of mine. You cannot predict wind gusts along the ground. The wind swirls around ground level. You can predict the wind aloft, since it does not vary much. Since your ball is going to be affected more by the wind aloft, you should play the wind aloft. There, that makes judging the wind easy. Bring a compass if you must.

[sui generis]

> @jimb6golf said:

> BAD just needs to speed up, along with a lot of other players (re: J Day, P Cantlay, etc.). The PGA needs to enforce the penalty for slow play not just put them on the clock. Instead of standing there waiting for your playing partner to hit, start working thru your preshot routine and calcs and then get on with it. Watching Cantlay shuffle back and forth over the weekend was horrible - even my wife said 'what is he doing, he looks silly'. I think even the networks are now starting to switch over to these horribly slow players later to avoid watching their silly preshot routines for too long (even the announcers were commenting on it this past weekend too).

 

You besmirch the PGA. That's wrong!

 

The thing you see on TV is a TV show run by a money making outfit called the PGA Tour. Their job is to get you to watch commercials and buy Buicks and Viagra. They have no interest in playing quickly.

[davep043]

> @"sui generis" said:

> > @jimb6golf said:

> > BAD just needs to speed up, along with a lot of other players (re: J Day, P Cantlay, etc.). The PGA needs to enforce the penalty for slow play not just put them on the clock. Instead of standing there waiting for your playing partner to hit, start working thru your preshot routine and calcs and then get on with it. Watching Cantlay shuffle back and forth over the weekend was horrible - even my wife said 'what is he doing, he looks silly'. I think even the networks are now starting to switch over to these horribly slow players later to avoid watching their silly preshot routines for too long (even the announcers were commenting on it this past weekend too).

>

> You besmirch the PGA. That's wrong!

>

> The thing you see on TV is a TV show run by a money making outfit called the PGA Tour. Their job is to get you to watch commercials and buy Buicks and Viagra. They have no interest in playing quickly.

 

More importantly, in my view, most of the players have no interests in pushing for tighter PoP rules, knowing that they may themselves be in penalized under those tighter rules in the future

[MidwestGolfBum]

> @davep043 said:

> > @"sui generis" said:

> > > @jimb6golf said:

> > > BAD just needs to speed up, along with a lot of other players (re: J Day, P Cantlay, etc.). The PGA needs to enforce the penalty for slow play not just put them on the clock. Instead of standing there waiting for your playing partner to hit, start working thru your preshot routine and calcs and then get on with it. Watching Cantlay shuffle back and forth over the weekend was horrible - even my wife said 'what is he doing, he looks silly'. I think even the networks are now starting to switch over to these horribly slow players later to avoid watching their silly preshot routines for too long (even the announcers were commenting on it this past weekend too).

> >

> > You besmirch the PGA. That's wrong!

> >

> > The thing you see on TV is a TV show run by a money making outfit called the PGA Tour. Their job is to get you to watch commercials and buy Buicks and Viagra. They have no interest in playing quickly.

>

> More importantly, in my view, most of the players have no interests in pushing for tighter PoP rules, knowing that they may themselves be in penalized under those tighter rules in the future

 

The players who are the most vocal about it are those on both ends of the argument. The notoriously slower players tend to give reasons why they are slow or why things take more time and the notoriously faster players are all about making everybody speed up because that is their comfortable speed. I get both sides, but in the end, they play for many, many millions of dollars in prize money and endorsements so sitting behind my keyboard I really get no say.

[DexterC]

> @physasst said:

> > @puttfordoux said:

> > > @physasst said:

> > > _DeChambeau, who has found himself repeatedly involved with issues of slow play, opened up on the issue to Golf Channel’s Will Gray. After receiving a warning for a bad time, DeChambeau made a double bogey.

> > >

> > > “We’ve had struggles the past three holes in a row, hazards and making bogeys and all that,” DeChambeau told Golf Channel. “Was that not factored in? ‘Well, it’s just 40 seconds, it is what it is,’ [he said]. Well, I don’t agree with that.”

> > >

> > > DeChambeau’s proposed solution includes counting the time between shots, not just the time spent once a player is at his ball.

> > >

> > > “It’s a bit unfair when you’ve got someone that’s behind you, let’s say, and they’re slower, but they’re quicker through their process. I get up there in the middle of the fairway and I have to wait for them to go, and then I have only my 40 seconds.”_

> > >

> > > https://www.golf.com/news/2019/05/30/tiger-woods-bryson-dechambeau-slow-play-frustration/

> > > I have to say, Bryson seems to be one of the players having a continuous issue with this. Thoughts?

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > simple solution...hit the ball in the fairway.

>

> I think he'd still take 5 minutes to hit a ball. Trying to figure out if solar radiation reflection off of Mars is affecting the ball flight....

 

Classic !!!

[physasst]

> @davep043 said:

> > @"sui generis" said:

> > > @jimb6golf said:

> > > BAD just needs to speed up, along with a lot of other players (re: J Day, P Cantlay, etc.). The PGA needs to enforce the penalty for slow play not just put them on the clock. Instead of standing there waiting for your playing partner to hit, start working thru your preshot routine and calcs and then get on with it. Watching Cantlay shuffle back and forth over the weekend was horrible - even my wife said 'what is he doing, he looks silly'. I think even the networks are now starting to switch over to these horribly slow players later to avoid watching their silly preshot routines for too long (even the announcers were commenting on it this past weekend too).

> >

> > You besmirch the PGA. That's wrong!

> >

> > The thing you see on TV is a TV show run by a money making outfit called the PGA Tour. Their job is to get you to watch commercials and buy Buicks and Viagra. They have no interest in playing quickly.

>

> More importantly, in my view, most of the players have no interests in pushing for tighter PoP rules, knowing that they may themselves be in penalized under those tighter rules in the future

 

I don't think anyone, outside of BK, is saying to change the PoP rules, just enforce the ones you already have. NBA has a shot clock. They're playing for millions of dollars....NFL has a play clock. Both have clear penalties and are enforced. That's all they have to do. Enforce what they already have....

[manku]

Was PoP a problem 30 years ago? Purses were smaller even with inflation and courses were shorter. Greens were slower too.

[buckeyefl]

> @JaNelson38 said:

> In all seriousness...I bet most everyone who complains about "slow play" would think again about it if there is the type of money attached to every shot like there is on the PGA Tour.

>

> There are slow players on Tour. But its actually not that many. And its not as big of a deal as some people make it out to be. I still maintain, as Ive said in another thread, that the length of rounds on the PGA Tour (especially Thursday and Friday) is the sheer amount of golfers on the course at the same time. All it takes is one wayward shot or one time where you need a ruling for the entire timing sequence to be thrown out of whack for the entire wave.

>

> I watched the NCAA Tournament Match Play on TV, and in my opinion there truly wasnt much difference between that and a PGA Tour event with regards to the time between shots. Just as much conversing, strategy, etc. There's just a ton of difference between playing golf for recreation and playing as your job. People think that just because they can play their 6000 yard muni track in 3.5 hours from a cart means PGA Tour pros who play for six figures every week are supposed to walk and play a 7300 yard course in 4 hours or less. Its absurd to think that way.

 

The money is irrelevant and a non issue as they all play under the same rules. It's simply an excuse.

 

Actually it's quite a few who are slow players on tour. Far too many in fact

[golfandfishing]

I started playing about 30 years ago, and in 1992 got my first job in the golf shop and bag room. Pace of play was a hot issue then, just like now. I would imagine that as soon as more than 4 people stated playing the game that pace of play was a topic.

 

> @manku said:

> Was PoP a problem 30 years ago? Purses were smaller even with inflation and courses were shorter. Greens were slower too.

 

 

[MidwestGolfBum]

> @golfandfishing said:

> I started playing about 30 years ago, and in 1992 got my first job in the golf shop and bag room. Pace of play was a hot issue then, just like now. I would imagine that as soon as more than 4 people stated playing the game that pace of play was a topic.

>

> > @manku said:

> > Was PoP a problem 30 years ago? Purses were smaller even with inflation and courses were shorter. Greens were slower too.

>

>

 

There always will be people who would like golf to be played faster. The era was never going to matter. Some won't care what the pace is because they are out there for a good time, business, or have no timeline on when they need to be done. It will be a conversation until the end of time, there's no doubt.

[manku]

> @golfandfishing said:

> I started playing about 30 years ago, and in 1992 got my first job in the golf shop and bag room. Pace of play was a hot issue then, just like now. I would imagine that as soon as more than 4 people stated playing the game that pace of play was a topic.

>

> > @manku said:

> > Was PoP a problem 30 years ago? Purses were smaller even with inflation and courses were shorter. Greens were slower too.

>

>

 

I"m not talking about recreational golf...seems to me that golf has gotten faster when I play compared to 25 years ago. There are definitely fewer golfers.

 

I don't buy the argument about how today's large purses are the reason and we would be doing the same if we were playing for millions. By that same logic, then MLB batters should be stepping out between every pitch, and tennis players should be waiting between every serve. Yet those two sports haven't changed time wise that much (well, MLB has, but that's mainly due to managers using a dozen pitchers a game!).

[davep043]

> @manku said:

> I don't buy the argument about how today's large purses are the reason and we would be doing the same if we were playing for millions.

 

For the most visible guys, with their income from prize money and endorsements, playing for the purses they do isn't a whole lot different from me playing a $10 Nassau. Neither one of us is going hungry if we miss a shot.

[MooJersey]

Also consider these guys are playing in threesomes.

[King_Slender]

> @Z1ggy16 said:

> Do most pro's not play "ready golf" as in, as soon as they get to the ball, (while waiting for the green to clear) they are getting the distance, checking the wind, planning where the ball needs to land, where the miss(es) is, etc? When I go play, I find my ball, laser/GPS my distance, check wind, pick club. Takes about 15 seconds.

>

 

I would say that many do not. They have a set routine, some from the moment they take the club from the bag, that they insist on following for every shot. I think it was Mike Weir who would get distracted and then reset his whole routine - all the say to putting the club back in the bag, and starting over. Not just backing off the shot - putting the club away.

 

 

 

[Pepperturbo]

Time limit exists for all golfers, the same. However, Bryson is an obsessive-compulsive odd-ball with some wins under his belt so he thinks it's OK for him to whine out loud. People don't like whiners, I am one. I hope he soon comes to grip with his reality and puts a plug in it as it impresses no one other than slow-minded pokes.