Loving the growth of golf right now, Loving the influx of people from all backgrounds but...

[bigred90gt]

On 4/13/2021 at 2:46 PM, jholz said:

 

Get to know the starters. Walk and carry. Be cool.

 

Before you know it, they'll be telling you to put the receipt back in your pocket and save it for next time. Been doing it since I was 11 years old.  

 

3 minutes ago, Soloman1 said:

It isn't one round for him. He says he doesn't ever pay by waving a receipt and putting it back in his pocket.

Perhaps you should actually read his post before you make yourself look like more of a pompous a— than you already do. focus on the part where the employee tells him to keep the receipt and save it for next time. 
 

strictly legally speaking, it’s called apparent authority, and nothing he is doing is illegal. 
 

if you go to a bar, order a drink, and the bartender says “that’s in me”, you going to force him to take your money? If not, are you stealing? What makes you think this is any different? 

[Soloman1]

And he's been doing this for years. Not a one-time deal. That's a big difference.

 

I'm not a taker. I pay my way in life.

 

 

Edited April 17, 2021 by Soloman1

[bigred90gt]

36 minutes ago, Soloman1 said:

And he's been doing this for years.

Point being? 
 

There is nothing wrong, morally or legally, from someone accepting a gift/offer of a perk from an employee for being a loyal customer. If you have a problem with it, that’s your problem, but legally speaking there is no problem for the customer in this situation. The employee could be reprimanded, but that does not reflect on the customer. 
 

amd I see you avoided answering the questions. I’m going to assume you did so because answering them honestly would prove your hypocrisy. 

[Soloman1]

I would leave a tip to more than cover the drink. Does that answer it? And again, it is not something perpetual. Why don't you address that?

 

How about you not addressing the question of a cashier not ringing up all of your purchases? A Costco cashier friend doesn't ring up all of your goods, but you're fine with that since he or she is liable?

 

If you're going to accept that, I consider it sleazy. Speaking of sleazy, are you a lawyer, since you're quoting the legal liability?

 

Oh and fini.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 17, 2021 by Soloman1

[HappyGilmoresBoots]

On 4/13/2021 at 7:26 PM, milesgiles said:

 

 

You do realise your actions have consequences on others? Your partners have to play quicker to keep pace with your slow poking, and youre holding the rest of the course up.

 

Slow play is selfish, since everyone else has to make adjustments to accomodate you 

...and your solution to speeding up play is to

 

<checks notes>

 

roll back the ball distance, thereby making everyone make more strokes per hole?

[milesgiles]

56 minutes ago, HappyGilmoresBoots said:

...and your solution to speeding up play is to

 

<checks notes>

 

roll back the ball distance, thereby making everyone make more strokes per hole?

 

what notes were you checking, cos Im certain I never said to roll the ball back, but I did agree to make the ball spin more and limit driver size to 250cc or so. You know, maybe return some 'skill' to the game?

 

Youre being disengenous if you state ANY type of rollback would slow people down, since even a nincompoop could see that we wouldnt have to play tees that were so far back 

[ThinkingPlus]

14 minutes ago, milesgiles said:

 

what notes were you checking, cos Im certain I never said to roll the ball back, but I did agree to make the ball spin more and limit driver size to 250cc or so. You know, maybe return some 'skill' to the game?

 

Youre being disengenous if you state ANY type of rollback would slow people down, since even a nincompoop could see that we wouldnt have to play tees that were so far back 

Except all the folks already playing the most forward tees, but they don't really count anyway, right?

[milesgiles]

7 hours ago, ThinkingPlus said:

Except all the folks already playing the most forward tees, but they don't really count anyway, right?

 

if they are the slowpokes (they arent) then what exactly is stopping other tees being built further forward particularly on the troublesome holes?

 

on balance, who is more likely to be causing slow play would you say? The guy going further back, or the one going further forward?

 

Have a think 

[bigred90gt]

7 hours ago, milesgiles said:

 

what notes were you checking, cos Im certain I never said to roll the ball back, but I did agree to make the ball spin more and limit driver size to 250cc or so. You know, maybe return some 'skill' to the game?

 

Youre being disengenous if you state ANY type of rollback would slow people down, since even a nincompoop could see that we wouldnt have to play tees that were so far back 

And a ball that spins more goes further offline, resulting in more time spent looking for balls, which means longer slower rounds. 
 

but you’re free to play those older clubs and balls that don’t go as far and spin more, respectively. No one is stopping you from working on or displaying your skill. 

Edited April 17, 2021 by bigred90gt

[ThinkingPlus]

29 minutes ago, milesgiles said:

 

if they are the slowpokes (they arent) then what exactly is stopping other tees being built further forward particularly on the troublesome holes?

 

on balance, who is more likely to be causing slow play would you say? The guy going further back, or the one going further forward?

 

Have a think 

New tees cost money that courses will not care to expend.  Slow play will be largely unaffected regardless although more strokes always takes longer whether you are a hare or a tortoise if you are playing stroke play and holing out.  You tend not to see slow play crop up as much with Stableford and match play formats.

[Medson]

Alright guys, I’m going to come clean. 
 

There was this one time I took bunch extra tees and took 2 pencils from the box. 
 

I’m so sorry. 

[Quasimoto]

23 hours ago, bigred90gt said:

 

Perhaps you should actually read his post before you make yourself look like more of a pompous a— than you already do. focus on the part where the employee tells him to keep the receipt and save it for next time. 
 

strictly legally speaking, it’s called apparent authority, and nothing he is doing is illegal. 
 

if you go to a bar, order a drink, and the bartender says “that’s in me”, you going to force him to take your money? If not, are you stealing? What makes you think this is any different? 

 

To me this comes down to authority. Does the bartender have the permission from the owner to supply free drinks? If he is owner, then yes. If not, is he just looking after buddies? Is he shorting other customers to supply those buddies?

Same thing with the golf. Does the person have authority to grant free rounds? Maybe. More likely not. And I bet that both employee and customer both know the scam. That puts the employee in jeopardy for his job, and, if I was the owner or GM and found this out I would ban them both from the course. It is stealing if it is a scam to cheat the club or bar out of revenue.

[milesgiles]

9 hours ago, ThinkingPlus said:

New tees cost money that courses will not care to expend.  Slow play will be largely unaffected regardless although more strokes always takes longer whether you are a hare or a tortoise if you are playing stroke play and holing out.  You tend not to see slow play crop up as much with Stableford and match play formats.

 

its about changing the culture of ever easier to hit  drivers, faster swing speeds and more balls being hit harder from further back just so duffers can feel like a pro. Courses that care about their customers will invest as necessary in more tee options 

[milesgiles]

10 hours ago, bigred90gt said:

And a ball that spins more goes further offline, resulting in more time spent looking for balls, which means longer slower rounds. 
 

but you’re free to play those older clubs and balls that don’t go as far and spin more, respectively. No one is stopping you from working on or displaying your skill. 

 

The spinnier ball is a suggestion for pro's and better golfers in particular. But you have to ask has golf got quicker over the years with a lower spinning ball? Or has it just encouraged course to get ever longer and bring just as much trouble into play off the tee, the only difference being you are now walking further..

 

Ive answered the second point endlessly 

[elwhippy]

Some new members sitting outside the clubhouse yesterday. Language was unacceptable and were overly loud despite being less than 50 yards from 18th green. Not the kind of people I want in my club. 

[ThinkingPlus]

4 hours ago, elwhippy said:

Some new members sitting outside the clubhouse yesterday. Language was unacceptable and were overly loud despite being less than 50 yards from 18th green. Not the kind of people I want in my club. 

Be careful.  Someone is going to beat you with a diversity stick for not being inclusive. 😉

[Hawkeye77]

5 hours ago, elwhippy said:

Some new members sitting outside the clubhouse yesterday. Language was unacceptable and were overly loud despite being less than 50 yards from 18th green. Not the kind of people I want in my club. 

LOL, too bad the kitchen doesn't have a specially printed "D____head Menu" someone can bring out to give them the hint ........ but, I'm positive your club is far too classy for those shenanigans.  Just tell me they weren't Americans!

[miamistomp]

 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

6 hours ago, elwhippy said:

Some new members sitting outside the clubhouse yesterday. Language was unacceptable and were overly loud despite being less than 50 yards from 18th green. Not the kind of people I want in my club. 

Introduce them to the code of conduct. If you don't have one then you should. Same as a dress code. 

 

No need to be passive aggressive about it either. It should be plainly overt and known that adherence is not optional. 

[Soloman1]

7 hours ago, elwhippy said:

Some new members sitting outside the clubhouse yesterday. Language was unacceptable and were overly loud despite being less than 50 yards from 18th green. Not the kind of people I want in my club. 

 

But wait, you said "live and let live" about a guy who plays a little con with a starter to not pay greens fees. You're OK with that, but this one-time noise thing upsets you?

 

Maybe you should, uh, live and let live?

 

🙂

[jholz]

1 hour ago, Soloman1 said:

 

But wait, you said "live and let live" about a guy who plays a little con with a starter to not pay greens fees. You're OK with that, but this one-time noise thing upsets you?

 

Maybe you should, uh, live and let live?

 

🙂

 

Hey @Soloman1, you seriously need to let this go. You are basing your disparagement of me on a false understanding of what I have described. Others have tried to point this out to you.

 

If you would like me to provide a more lengthy and detailed explanation of what I am talking about, I'm more than happy to provide it. Just let me know. I'm here. I'm willing to talk to you.

 

In the meantime, I'd appreciate it if you stop calling me a thief and otherwise dragging my name through the mud. You don't know me. 

 

I'm a good guy, a long standing member of this forum, and I don't deserve it. Please stop. 

[bs812]

I recently started playing again after a 10 year hiatus. I had an elbow injury, raising two kids, career and in general wasn't able to dedicate the necessary time to my game. I will tell you it seems like a lot more people not fixing divots now and also the music in the carts is taking some getting used to. Im just happy to be playing again without pain 🙂

[tannyhoban]

Checks in on thread. Okey dokey then.

moving along

[chillybilly]

If money changes hands for greens and/or cart fees then the course has obligations, starting with tee times.  A tee time is a two-way obligation and if the intervals are eight minutes then by God they should be eight minutes.  'Tee off when the group ahead is on the green' is not an interval, not a tee time and almost never eight minutes.  It invariably results in a backup on the next hole or somewhere within the first four holes that might take the next 14 to erase - but rarely does.  Waiting on every tee, every fairway and having groups arrive or watch as you hit every tee shot is a) infuriating, b) pointless and c) eminently avoidable if the starter is doing his job.  Giving me the 'have you played here before....our flags are red/white/blue' speech is not the job.  Managing traffic is the job.

 

Aside:  one day there will be a logical explanation for starters/rangers and their obsession with carts and numbers.  They write them down before #1 tee.  They write them down as you pass and wave.  Ironically, they rarely take any notice when you actually return them.  I've heard tales of individual cart theft, even of the theft of fleets in whole or in part during an organized, nighttime raid but rarely or never of theft by players actively and visibly playing course - especially when those players have actual vehicles back at the clubhouse.  The proportionality of cart-number-tracking OCD to the actual threat of loss seems well out of whack.  I often joke that someone could lie bleeding in a bunker and the ranger would jot down the cart number, wave and keep going.  To add insult to injury, these same rangers will drive past 3 or 4 groups on a single hole (!?) and say nothing about pace of play or and will make no attempting at determining or alleviating the bottleneck.  I have played thousands of rounds and have had the group I was in admonished about pace of play less than 10 times.  I am admittedly a pace-of-play hawk and a bit of a 'secret agent' in picking up/moving clubs on the ground so they will be easily collected, moving carts that aren't my own etc. in order to facilitate group movement through the hole and simply encouraging ready golf as and when people start to slip into bad habits. 

 

Being a paying customer - or member - also entitles one to the sounds of nature which is (or was) a significant part of the experience.  Birds, winds, etc.  Nature aside, the ability to hear and analyze the sound of club striking ball is an integral part of the game and, if applicable, competition.  I can see my shot is thin, for example, but I have to also be able to hear the sound to tell me the when, where, how and why of impact. Tommy Tacky and his Bluetooth speaker blasting horrid music should never be part of the experience. It's also a safe bet that Tommy Tacky doesn't know or care what the USGA or R&A have to say on the subject. Tommy Tacky spends 90% of his life with his AirPods shoved into his ears yet won't use them on the golf course where they would be most useful for everyone concerned.  It defies logic.  Sorry but audible music should be banned.  There is a win-win scenario here.  If you want 120 dB in your ears and never hear a bird song, that's your lookout.  Don't make it mine. 

Edited August 9, 2021 by chillybilly

[chippa13]

I've been to plenty of courses where the starter will hold groups at the first tee until the group ahead is on the first green. It builds in nice spacing. That doesn't mean you wait on every tee until the group ahead is on the green, just the first.

[me05501]

On 4/16/2021 at 11:54 PM, bigred90gt said:

Point being? 
 

There is nothing wrong, morally or legally, from someone accepting a gift/offer of a perk from an employee for being a loyal customer. If you have a problem with it, that’s your problem, but legally speaking there is no problem for the customer in this situation. The employee could be reprimanded, but that does not reflect on the customer. 
 

amd I see you avoided answering the questions. I’m going to assume you did so because answering them honestly would prove your hypocrisy. 

 

If someone routinely doesn't pay, can they really be called "a loyal customer?" 

If all their customers were so loyal they'd be out of business. 

[ShortGolfer]

Is the dress code more lenient when it is brutally hot and humid? I am used to living without air conditioning to keep my electric bill really low.

When I played as a kid we never had bad weather.  I'd imagine that on some days I'd have the course all to myself.  I looked at the last two tee time sheets for a local private club and there were no Monday tee times after mid morning.  Everyone chose the early morning slots.

Edited August 9, 2021 by ShortGolfer

[mangohead]

On 10/29/2020 at 5:54 PM, golfandfishing said:

I started playing in about 1990, worked the bagroom at a local private club when I was 14. Aside from the music, every issue you brought up were points if contention then as well, plus several others that are still talked about today - cigarette butts, slow play, hats on backwards, shirts tucked in. There will always be a few people stuck on being pretentious, and there will always be a few determined to piss them off. The rest of us reside in a world where we don’t care about either of them. 

Shirts tucked in is the correct way.   Did you mean untucked shirts?

[mangohead]

I've never heard of this music trend.

Are people bringing BT speakers in their cart?

Playing it from phone in pocket?

[mangohead]

On 12/1/2020 at 7:03 AM, phizzy30 said:

 Golf is a great way to blow off steam and meet new people IMO. 

 

How do you meet new people while golfing ?

Hit into them and apologize ?