Golfers show inevitability of a paunch at middle age

[Soloman1]

People don't know what a bad diet is because advertising tells them what's bad is good and what's good is bad.

 

The US food industry doesn't make anything fit for human consumption, they make what's healthy for their bottom line. The fatter you are, the more food you'll buy. Hell, go look at the packages of meat (chicken, turkey, beef, ham, etc.) at the supermarket. They all have sugar. Who the hell puts sugar in this "supposed" organic, blah, blah, healthy choice meat?

 

Here's something about the oils in food today:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQmqVVmMB3k

 

It's a tough road for anyone now to find foods that are good for them.

[ShortGolfer]

 

My wife watched me carefully and concluded I ate way less than she did.

I find I can eat bad foods and still have good lab results just by eating less and gardening for exercise.

I love pot luck dinners as I get to taste so many different deserts.

 

My results are good enough that my doctor says to continue whatever I'm doing.

[jonsnow]

On 9/25/2021 at 2:53 PM, playit said:

I don't know if it is inevitable, I am hoping for discussion! Not until the covid era did I add on enough belly weight that I sport the proverbial paunch. It also coincided with age 66 and 67, so, who knows what caused it. And, yes, I have gained weight continuously since high school. Perhaps it's simply more of the same progression! But I watched some of a senior tour event and thought, "My gosh, they're all fat!" Not all, but most. Of course, this is also what has happened to the USA as a whole, overweight has skyrocketed over the past 30-40 years. (I think it's crappy diet related... cheap carbs is my guess.)

 

But these tour players are not your average American, they're still athletes and more active than most. So, the question is, do you think that for men, sporting such a paunch is inevitable with age? Must it be so? Do you think it is simply due to the sagging of skin and muscles and plain old gravity doing its thing?

 

Also, can it be cured? I would like to lose this extra weight and wonder how reasonable it it to think that a 67, almost 68 year old man could become trim again. Methinks it would require an intense training program to do so. Which I am willing to do.

 

As for that broadcast, I saw John Cook and thought, "Hmmm... his paunch looks kinda like mine."

 

Hope you will chime in!

I admire your optimism referring to ages 66-67 as "middle age". Most of us don't make it to our 130s.

[liquorandpoker]

You can't outrun or outwork your diet

 

Gotta watch the calories in man

 

And yes.... it IS terrible, terrible news

Edited September 30, 2021 by liquorandpoker
Corrected typo

[golfandfishing]

On 9/25/2021 at 12:53 PM, MtlJeff said:

If you stay active and eat well you should be able to stay in decent enough shape until your later ages. Also it's not crazy hard to lose weight if you make a couple of basic changes, again getting some exercise in (even of it's just something low impact like an elliptical) and getting a side salad instead of fries

 

When I lost a lot of weight other than jogging, the biggest changes I made were no more fries, and always getting fish on business trip dinners

Bam. Doing the same now and down 40lbs since end of May, looking at 40 more to get to 200. Had a string of injuries to my feet and back that kept me from any real activity and basically out of golf, threw in a kid 5 years ago and I had packed on about 20lbs to what as already an overweight (although usable in most ways) frame. Smaller portions of better food and 7,500 minimum steps per day and 2 lbs come off every week like clockwork. I played some decent golf this summer and bought size 38 shorts yesterday, in May my 42s were snug. Eating is the biggest factor, you can’t outrun a bad diet. 

[jonsnow]

40 minutes ago, golfandfishing said:

Bam. Doing the same now and down 40lbs since end of May, looking at 40 more to get to 200. Had a string of injuries to my feet and back that kept me from any real activity and basically out of golf, threw in a kid 5 years ago and I had packed on about 20lbs to what as already an overweight (although usable in most ways) frame. Smaller portions of better food and 7,500 minimum steps per day and 2 lbs come off every week like clockwork. I played some decent golf this summer and bought size 38 shorts yesterday, in May my 42s were snug. Eating is the biggest factor, you can’t outrun a bad diet. 

You are now my hero! Thanks for showing it can be done.

[DallasDan]

I cut out sugar (white sugar, soda, cookies, cake) and also bread/pasta. The weight came off very quickly. I went from 192 to 173 in 3 weeks. I have been able to keep it off for the most part. I'll get into a cheat mode and the weight will spike up into the high 170's but as soon as I cut that sugar/carbs out the weight comes back off. I'm 48 for reference. 

 

It's 80% what you put in your body and 20% exercise. 

 

Cut out the McDonalds, Whataburger and Wendy's. Not to say that I have completely cut those delectable restaurants out of my diet but I have cut down to maybe once per week on my cheat day which is Mondays after a weekend of golf. 

[milesgiles]

18 minutes ago, DallasDan said:

I cut out sugar (white sugar, soda, cookies, cake) and also bread/pasta. The weight came off very quickly. I went from 192 to 173 in 3 weeks. I have been able to keep it off for the most part. I'll get into a cheat mode and the weight will spike up into the high 170's but as soon as I cut that sugar/carbs out the weight comes back off. I'm 48 for reference. 

 

It's 80% what you put in your body and 20% exercise. 

 

Cut out the McDonalds, Whataburger and Wendy's. Not to say that I have completely cut those delectable restaurants out of my diet but I have cut down to maybe once per week on my cheat day which is Mondays after a weekend of golf. 

 

simplicity in all things.. Id suggest you stick with a favourite belt, and you'll know when youve been bad as it gets too snug. Thats when I cut back on the sugar and bad stuff, the scale isnt important 

[RSinSG]

Several “you can’t outrun a diet” quotes here. While that’s probably true for us older guys it was not the case when I was younger. I was very active / athletic and ate like every meal was my last one. Pizza and burgers  were food groups. And then I hit the 30’s and things changed. Activity became inconsistent and I had to watch my diet. 
 

Marriage and raising a large family made it easy to skip working out and over the years I had long periods when I was in good shape and times when I wasn’t. Now I’m 70 and while I’m in relatively good shape I’m carrying too much weight in my “paunch” and have to be careful what I eat. I walk 18 holes 2x a week, live on an acre with horses so I’m lifting 100 lb bales of hay and doing other physical chores, but I don’t think I’m ever going to be wearing sz 30 Levi’s again. But I discovered there are stretchy Levi’s and I fit into 34’s like I used to 20 years ago. 😁

[jonsnow]

2 hours ago, RSinSG said:

Several “you can’t outrun a diet” quotes here. While that’s probably true for us older guys it was not the case when I was younger. I was very active / athletic and ate like every meal was my last one. Pizza and burgers  were food groups. And then I hit the 30’s and things changed. Activity became inconsistent and I had to watch my diet. 
 

Marriage and raising a large family made it easy to skip working out and over the years I had long periods when I was in good shape and times when I wasn’t. Now I’m 70 and while I’m in relatively good shape I’m carrying too much weight in my “paunch” and have to be careful what I eat. I walk 18 holes 2x a week, live on an acre with horses so I’m lifting 100 lb bales of hay and doing other physical chores, but I don’t think I’m ever going to be wearing sz 30 Levi’s again. But I discovered there are stretchy Levi’s and I fit into 34’s like I used to 20 years ago. 😁

If you live on an acre with horses, I hope they are really small horses...

[Barfolomew]

Holy crap I can gain weight so fast if I wanted to like really fast, the other way not so much 🤣

[NoTalentLefty]

I’m a deep believer in weight gain as you grow old at the same rate as wrinkles start appearing. That way the fat fills in and smooths those out. The down side , by my calculations, I’ll way weigh 300 lbs in 10 years. 

[chipa]

Most people don't have any idea of their caloric needs nor the amount of calories that they consume so gaining weight is inevitable, and I wasn't any different until something changed in my life. I got up to 180 at 51 and am now at 150 at 56. 

 

Losing weight is not easy as one has to manage a caloric deficit which for some people in nearly impossible to maintain for any length of time as it is so uncomfortable to be hungry all the time. Throw in the diminished energy levels and it becomes even worse with age.

 

Nonetheless, if one is willing to go without eating dinner practically for good the body will start to produce ketones which act as an additional source of energy. The ketones also have the effect of reducing hunger pains when one is in caloric deficit, so fasting at a deficit of 200-300 calories is not difficult. It is much easier to do than for a person whose body is not producing ketones, especially if they are older.

 

Also, in order for the weight loss to be effective one has to learn to count calories, but this is quite easy and many create a spreadsheet for their typical meals. Also, going without dinner decreases inflammation and regulates sugar levels better.

 

A deficit of 200 calories is about 5 lbs a month and I wouldn't recommend much more than that to give the skin time to shrink.

 

This is also called the Hugh Jackman/16:8 diet and is a type of intermittent fasting, but its not necessarily a fast if one doesn't want to lose weight as the body receives the minimum daily calories it needs.

 

In my own case given my health problems and desire to play golf and weight train it was an easy decision for me because when one is not in caloric deficit one maintains high energy levels due to the ketones. I would say my energy levels are what they were probably 15-20 years ago for me. This has enabled me to be more active, weight train heavier and more often and with the added benefit of less inflammation, recover quicker. In 5 years I have probably eaten dinner 5 times or less. If I do something that consumes calories, like practicing golf late at night or training, I can replace those calories without causing my body to kick me out of the ketone production. Generally no more than 100-120 calories and only sugar like a soft drink or chocolate, but no protein or complex carbohydrates.

 

[bill.ig]

2 hours ago, NoTalentLefty said:

I’m a deep believer in weight gain as you grow old at the same rate as wrinkles start appearing. That way the fat fills in and smooths those out. The down side , by my calculations, I’ll way weigh 300 lbs in 10 years. 

 

Old man in a bar once told my wife and me, “fat don’t wrinkle”.

[Santiago Golf]

The day I graduate high school ... I was right around 145

 

The day I started college ... I was right around 155

 

By the time I was 19 ... I was 210 pounds!!!! 

 

There was some stretches were I lost a little weight ... but no less than 185 range

 

I happy to say I sit at a lean 155 to 165 (26 years old) ... I actually got under 150 during Summer of 2020 (I living in the desert of California) 

 

I going to try to get back down to 145 (or lower) this Winter ... then start trying to pack on some muscle

 

The biggest thing I stress is diet (to be completely transparent my diet sucks right ... I don't have access to a kitchen or healthy food, I will come November

 

at 21 years old I started trying to eat a pescatarian diet and haven't eaten meat on purpose in over 4 years (accident will happen time to time when a restaurant messes up my order)

 

Walking is huge, stretching is huge, being positive is huge

[ShowMe]

2 hours ago, chipa said:

Most people don't have any idea of their caloric needs nor the amount of calories that they consume so gaining weight is inevitable, and I wasn't any different until something changed in my life. I got up to 180 at 51 and am now at 150 at 56. 

 

Losing weight is not easy as one has to manage a caloric deficit which for some people in nearly impossible to maintain for any length of time as it is so uncomfortable to be hungry all the time. Throw in the diminished energy levels and it becomes even worse with age.

 

Nonetheless, if one is willing to go without eating dinner practically for good the body will start to produce ketones which act as an additional source of energy. The ketones also have the effect of reducing hunger pains when one is in caloric deficit, so fasting at a deficit of 200-300 calories is not difficult. It is much easier to do than for a person whose body is not producing ketones, especially if they are older.

 

Also, in order for the weight loss to be effective one has to learn to count calories, but this is quite easy and many create a spreadsheet for their typical meals. Also, going without dinner decreases inflammation and regulates sugar levels better.

 

A deficit of 200 calories is about 5 lbs a month and I wouldn't recommend much more than that to give the skin time to shrink.

 

This is also called the Hugh Jackman/16:8 diet and is a type of intermittent fasting, but its not necessarily a fast if one doesn't want to lose weight as the body receives the minimum daily calories it needs.

 

In my own case given my health problems and desire to play golf and weight train it was an easy decision for me because when one is not in caloric deficit one maintains high energy levels due to the ketones. I would say my energy levels are what they were probably 15-20 years ago for me. This has enabled me to be more active, weight train heavier and more often and with the added benefit of less inflammation, recover quicker. In 5 years I have probably eaten dinner 5 times or less. If I do something that consumes calories, like practicing golf late at night or training, I can replace those calories without causing my body to kick me out of the ketone production. Generally no more than 100-120 calories and only sugar like a soft drink or chocolate, but no protein or complex carbohydrates.

 

 

Careful.  High levels of ketones can be dangerous.

 

Oh, and you need protein to build muscle.  See below:

 

Protein intake is absolutely essential if your goal is to build muscle. Protein is the building block for tissue growth and repair, and without this, you will not be providing your body with the tools it needs to grow new tissue! If you want to increase your muscle mass then you must be in a consistent calorie surplus.

[bladehunter]

Cut out sugar.  All of it. And beer if you drink it.  Which is sugar.   Then exercise some.  Get a jump rope.  Walk while you play. Swim laps. Something easy like those 3.   The gut will leave. 

[chipa]

12 hours ago, ShowMe said:

 

Careful.  High levels of ketones can be dangerous.

 

Oh, and you need protein to build muscle.  See below:

 

Protein intake is absolutely essential if your goal is to build muscle. Protein is the building block for tissue growth and repair, and without this, you will not be providing your body with the tools it needs to grow new tissue! If you want to increase your muscle mass then you must be in a consistent calorie surplus.

 

I think there is some confusion about ketosis. Nothing I've read indicates the ketones produced by intermittent fasting only causes any health problem, on the contrary they are very beneficial.

 

There is a complication of diabetes that can cause ketones to be bad for the body and for those that use a low carb diet to obtain ketosis the high level of protein can cause problems, but this has nothing to do with ketosis but apparently many associate the two, because I have heard this before.

 

As far as protein goes, I've found the standard recommended daily allowance of 1 gram per kilogram of bodyweight is sufficient. I use about 25 grams of whey protein as a supplement, but that can be substituted by 3 glasses of milk.

[JustTheTips]

On 9/30/2021 at 10:25 AM, DallasDan said:

I cut out sugar (white sugar, soda, cookies, cake) and also bread/pasta. The weight came off very quickly. I went from 192 to 173 in 3 weeks. I have been able to keep it off for the most part. I'll get into a cheat mode and the weight will spike up into the high 170's but as soon as I cut that sugar/carbs out the weight comes back off. I'm 48 for reference. 

 

It's 80% what you put in your body and 20% exercise. 

 

Cut out the McDonalds, Whataburger and Wendy's. Not to say that I have completely cut those delectable restaurants out of my diet but I have cut down to maybe once per week on my cheat day which is Mondays after a weekend of golf. 

20lbs in 3 weeks is a ton of water weight. It is the same thing that causes you to put on 5lbs when you do the cheat day. The next 10-15 lbs takes a lot longer:)

 

With all things it is a balance of effort. It is easy to cut more calories from the diet than exercise. Pretty easy to cut from eating say 3k to 2k by cutting out crap like beer, soda, cakes, and the rest of high fat/high sugar diet items... . But cutting to say 1500 gets much harder. Somewhere it becomes easier to burn those 500 calories by exercising rather than messing with diet. And very minimal amounts of strength training (i.e. like 20 mins 2-3x/week) has show to really help with maintaining muscle mass as you age.

 

 

[PostandGhost]

11 minutes ago, JustTheTips said:

20lbs in 3 weeks is a ton of water weight. It is the same thing that causes you to put on 5lbs when you do the cheat day. The next 10-15 lbs takes a lot longer:)

 

With all things it is a balance of effort. It is easy to cut more calories from the diet than exercise. Pretty easy to cut from eating say 3k to 2k by cutting out crap like beer, soda, cakes, and the rest of high fat/high sugar diet items... . But cutting to say 1500 gets much harder. Somewhere it becomes easier to burn those 500 calories by exercising rather than messing with diet. And very minimal amounts of strength training (i.e. like 20 mins 2-3x/week) has show to really help with maintaining muscle mass as you age.

 

 

I completely agree that it's easier to lose weight through diet than exercise but don't cut out the fat!  

 

A high fat diet can lead to a more metabolically versatile body that stays satiated longer.  In fact, the most weight I have ever lost, about 20% of my body weight, was by eating foods with more fat than carbs (e.g. olives, avocados, sardines, mackerel, sardines, macadamia nuts, ghee, goat cheese, red meat).  Don't worry about counting total carbs or trying to get into ketosis. 

 

I know it sounds backwards but a fat adapted diet will help get rid of the white adipose tissue that can cause the visceral fat around the organs (pot belly).  Oleic Acid in the fat will actually help you burn fat.  The fat won't blow up your blood glucose and cause insulin resistance either.  Eat things high in Omega 3s, MCTs, MUFAs, and foods with a long chain fatty acid profile.  Stay balanced and diversified when consuming fats because you can have too much of a good thing if you focus on one fat in particular.  Your body won't store the fats in the same way that it does with protein and carbohydrates.  

 

I also highly recommend intermittent fasting if someone is trying to lose weight.  

[phizzy30]

On 9/25/2021 at 12:53 PM, MtlJeff said:

If you stay active and eat well you should be able to stay in decent enough shape until your later ages. Also it's not crazy hard to lose weight if you make a couple of basic changes, again getting some exercise in (even of it's just something low impact like an elliptical) and getting a side salad instead of fries

 

When I lost a lot of weight other than jogging, the biggest changes I made were no more fries, and always getting fish on business trip dinners

Maintaining a healthy diet and exercising is great but it ultimately comes down to genetics which includes test and cortisol levels and insulin resistance.  I have had male clients that no matter how hard they dieted didn't lose more than 10 pounds and it wasn't until I recommended them go get their hormone levels tested and taken care of did they lose any more considerable amount of weight. 

[chipa]

25 minutes ago, phizzy30 said:

Maintaining a healthy diet and exercising is great but it ultimately comes down to genetics which includes test and cortisol levels and insulin resistance.  I have had male clients that no matter how hard they dieted didn't lose more than 10 pounds and it wasn't until I recommended them go get their hormone levels tested and taken care of did they lose any more considerable amount of weight. 

 

I have offered to count calories for people that couldn't lose weight and it turns out they didn't realize how high their caloric intake was or didn't count accurately enough.

 

There are certainly different metabolic rates but if a person intakes less than his body consumes they will lose weight. This is very uncomfortable for many people and this is why I have told people about the 16:8 diet to increase their ketones so that they can be in caloric defect w/o feeling very strong hunger pains.

 

Unfortunately there is so much misinformation out there many think this is a high protein diet, it is not, it is a high carb diet with only the min. protein intake recommended. The only real detail is one does not eat from 3:30 pm to 7:30 am other than that as long as one counts their calories they can eat whatever they want. I eat hotdogs, potato chips, cookies, cake, drink coke and beer almost everyday.

 

BTW, the 16:8 diet is not a diet nor is intermittent fasting as long as the body has the min. calories but I think "diet" and "fasting" turn people away from trying it.

Edited October 1, 2021 by chipa

[VNutz]

For anybody unaware of calorie levels and just how much they're consuming on a daily basis vs what the body needs, there are apps out there like MyFitnessPal that make it really easy, and eye opening, to see just how much you consume on a daily basis. From there you can understand why you are or aren't gaining weight and how to approach your goals. I'm currently down about 30 pounds from where I was 3 years ago (was 40 until this summer 😞 ) and it all started with understanding what I was eating.

[Yuck]

I am in my early 60’s and have been heavy set most of my adult life.  I am now about 260 which is about 35 lbs below my peak.  I would like to be around 225 which was my Army weight and probably my peak condition.  I walk all rounds, do not drink, eat fast food etc.  But I will not be able to exercise my way down to 225.  20+ years ago, I lost 100 lbs over about a 15 month period to get down to 195.    I was told I looked frail & haggard.  (When I was 295, my lean body mass was about 225, So I did loose quite a bit of muscle)  I was much weaker and my wife encouraged me to put some weight back on.  (That was easy).  On the plus side, my body is not any worse than it was in my 30’s, 40’s & 50’s aside from that period of “emaciation”.   Realistically.  A pound a week or so until I am 240 will make me happy.  I am clearly overweight / obese at current weight.

[jonsnow]

I have a theory I call "aerobic eating"; if you eat hard enough to sweat profusely while you eat, you can actually burn more calories than you consume. Ipso facto, weight loss. 

 

It's a theory I've been testing for about 45 years now & I have to admit so far the test results don't support the theory. I just think it's important to get a large enough sample size before we discredit it...

[Zitlow]

intermittent fasting is a fairly easy way to lose weight. Fast for 16 hours and eat 2 or 3 meals, no snacks in the 8 hour window. 

[Redpro]

On 9/30/2021 at 9:25 AM, DallasDan said:

I cut out sugar (white sugar, soda, cookies, cake) and also bread/pasta. The weight came off very quickly. I went from 192 to 173 in 3 weeks. I have been able to keep it off for the most part. I'll get into a cheat mode and the weight will spike up into the high 170's but as soon as I cut that sugar/carbs out the weight comes back off. I'm 48 for reference. 

 

It's 80% what you put in your body and 20% exercise. 

 

Cut out the McDonalds, Whataburger and Wendy's. Not to say that I have completely cut those delectable restaurants out of my diet but I have cut down to maybe once per week on my cheat day which is Mondays after a weekend of golf. 

They're gonna have to pry those Whataburger bacon-egg-cheese biscuits from my cold, dead hands! LOL. 

[RoyalMustang]

On 9/25/2021 at 9:03 PM, 2bGood said:

I play at course where just about everyone walks and there are PLENTY of guts. 

 

I am sure there are guys that can run the numbers, but on my calorie counting app the difference between walking and carting is like 300 calories or about 1.5 pints.

 

It is pretty tough to exercise your way thin if you have a high calorie diet. 

 

 

 

I walked yesterday and the "walking" part registered 780 calories (It is a long course with distance between holes).  Throw in the elevation and pushing a 30-lb cart and it was more like 1,000.  

 

I suppose it depends.  300 calories is what I got tonight going for a 3.3 mile brisk walk with my wife.  It still adds up: that is 9000 calories a month if you did it every day, which is nearly 3 pounds.  A year of that gives you approximately 32 pounds lost; it isn't chump change! 

[johnrobison]

9 hours ago, RoyalMustang said:

 

I walked yesterday and the "walking" part registered 780 calories (It is a long course with distance between holes).  Throw in the elevation and pushing a 30-lb cart and it was more like 1,000.  

 

I suppose it depends.  300 calories is what I got tonight going for a 3.3 mile brisk walk with my wife.  It still adds up: that is 9000 calories a month if you did it every day, which is nearly 3 pounds.  A year of that gives you approximately 32 pounds lost; it isn't chump change! 

Sure, but the difference between walking and cart golf is maybe 300-600 calories, depending on various factors. But, again, it's not whether golfers are walking that accounts for the growing guts. It's almost entirely about their diet.

[bortass]

At the end of the day there are a bunch of different ways to do this. The goal is the same, take in less calories than you burn and you'll drop weight. The hardest part is finding a way that works and is easy for you.

 

 Just in this thread we've seen a bunch of different ways people do it and they seem to have success. The easiest diet I ever did was South Beach. I dropped 60 lbs in about 3 months and I never really felt hungry. I was the only one in the house trying to do it though and it didn't stick. Right now I'm doing WW since work pays for it and I have had success with it a long time ago. I rarely feel hungry and I've cleaned up some of what I eat but in no way am I eating clean. There's still too many processed carbs in the mix but it's better than it was before I started and I'm dropping over 2 lbs a week with no change in my activity levels. It's great to put on clothes that I haven't fit in for a few years.

 

Some people like Paleo, Keto, Intermittent Fasting, If It Fits Your Macros, etc. etc. Find the process that fits you and your lifestyle the best and you'll see success. It's not a given that we are all doomed to having a paunch because I play with a couple guys in their 70s and early 80s that don't have one.