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Hole 5 kicks my but almost every time. You have about a 20 yard window to drive through and there is a pond down the left side. As a lefty, if it goes at all left, it's gone.

 

I can hit anything off the tee fine except my driver that I still slice at times. I am stubborn and hit my driver because I'm supposed to. I have lost balls left and right on this damn hole.

 

Do you have that one hole? 🤣

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Lets take a closer look at the 15th at the Tapiola Golf Club in Espoo Finland. A par 4 of 455 yards from the back tees, or 425 for members. The hole plays into the wind and ever so slightly downhill,

So that's what the 18th at Augusta would look like after financial struggles coupled with 1970s Los Angeles smog.   I've often wondered..

190 yards always into the wind and the greens about 15 yards deep and 70 wide.  Eats me up more often than not 

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There're a couple from our regular tracks I can think of that I dread ... #16 at Rustic Canyon, #14 at Destroyer ... but the one that I most absolutely hate is #6 at Angeles National. 

 

I love that course so much but that goddamn hole. 

 

It's about 420 yards. Pretty much always playing into the wind and it has a very daunting waste area about 230-240 out that spans a good 50 yards. You kinda have to not hit driver off the tee as it's generally a tighter, dryer course and the ball wants to run. So I tend to always tee off with 3W and that leaves me usually a 5 iron in. And while it's not ACTUALLY a tough shot ... just hit a sold iron. It just LOOKS like one because of how big that waste area is and the way it frames the green. And the green is massive and there's plenty of landing area short ... but visually, it messes with my head and I pretty much never hit a decent approach in the dozens of times I've played it.

 

I think the only time I haven't blown it is when the wind was fierce and I had like 200 in, striped my hybrid and got out of there with a par. That has happened precisely once in the dozens of times I've played it.

 

I get out of there with bogey, I'm pretty happy. That damn hole has ruined my scorecard more than a few times. Of course, the same can be said of #16 at Rustic but I don't have a sense of impending dread as I approach it. 

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Every course has one, doesn't it?

At my home course it's the second hole.  First, it's the #1 handicapped hole.  Dense forest right, waste area left and a water hazard left of the waste area.  Plus it's long, so if you don't take on the waste area to the left and try to cut some of the dogleg off you'll end up with an approach over 200yds.  I've played the hole over a hundred times I'm sure and my average is above bogey.  I've birdied it maybe 3x. Escaping with a par feels like stealing.

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Our course has a hole i consider the toughest stroke play hole i've ever played. And many other players would likely have it up there too

 

It's a 425yd 90 degree dogleg left that basically goes 215yds , than depending how close you hit to the corner and with how much action, you can have 180-225yds in (usually ~200). It's impossible to cut the corner because the trees are too high and the landing area too narrow

 

Now for the fun part....There is OB that runs the entire length of the hole down the right side of the 2nd leg (after the dogleg). This ALSO means that OB is in play if you hit the ball too long on your tee shot since it's a 90 degree dogleg, so your tee shot faces the OB. So you have to hit it at least 200 or so to reach the dogleg, but 230+ will go OB. 

 

Now for even more fun, the LEFT side of the hole once you clear the dogleg is all either wooded or staked, and it isn't a wide hole. So on your 2nd shot into the green you have basically forest and unplayable ditch on one side, and OB on the other....and you are hitting a 200yd approach. 

 

And the cherry of course, is that the green was originally a par 5 green so is incredibly un-receptive to long clubs, and the front of it is essentially a redan. They love to put front pins. 

 

 

 

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El Caballero CC that my father is a member at.  The second hole is the hole from hell.  Hard dog leg left with OB left, right and if you hit it too far the fairway runs out into a steep bank that is lined with bushes and trees and I've see rattle snakes occasionally as well so forget about looking for your ball.  It's 390 from the whites which is usually where I play from.  You either have to lay up short of the fairway bunker which is about 230 yards(4 iron for me) where the hole starts to curve sharp to the left or you can take driver or 3 metal and hit it high over the trees on the left and hope and pray it cuts 20 yards right and lands in the rough or fairway and doesn't roll out too much or you end up being in the right rough where the grass is pretty long year round however, a bomb off the tee leaves me about 100 yards in.  I've played the hole both ways and tend to find it better if I take the risk of taking driver and hitting it over the trouble on the left but have never made birdie on that hole and have made a couple triples and countless doubles.  FYI, it's the hardest hole on the course and for good reason. 

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#16 at Eagle Pointe in Mont Belvieu, TX just outside of Houston. It has got to be the worst hole design in the entire Houston area. It’s a par 4 that plays to at lease a par 5 for most golfers. 
 

from the tee, it is about 250-260 to a steep drop off with gnarly rough down to a ditch. Problem is, it plays downhill, so a well struck 3 wood can leave you dead, and it takes driver out of your hands. If you keep it short of the ditch, you have anywhere from 190-220 to a severely sloped green, and you’re hitting from a severe (by our south Texas standards) downhill lie. On the other side of the ditch, there is a small landing area, then a pond, then another 120 or so yards to the green. There’s a water feature to the left that eats wayward shots, and woods right that do the same. I’ve played that course probably a few hundred times, and I can count the birdies on one hand. I bet I’ve only parred it a couple dozen times as well, and I’m a single digit index (my lowest was a 2.x, and I’m currently a 6). We all hate it, we expect a bogey, and try not to let worse ruin a round. 

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The course I was a member at from 2016-2018 had two holes, #17 and #18. I donated a few boxes of balls to those two holes over those three seasons. 

 

17 is a par 3. Water on the left, right, and off the back. Tips played at 200-210 yards. Blues at 170-180. A lot of the older guys would play a short iron to the fairway in front, and take their chances with getting the ball up and down. 

 

18 is a 410 yard par 4. Off the tee there's water just in front of the tee, and water that follows along both the left and right sides of the fairway for about 275-300 yards. The second shot to the green only has water on the left, and front left of the green. If you don't hit driver off the tee, you're probably leaving yourself 180 or more in on the second shot. 

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Lets take a closer look at the 15th at the Tapiola Golf Club in Espoo Finland. A par 4 of 455 yards from the back tees, or 425 for members. The hole plays into the wind and ever so slightly downhill, to a fairway that is littered with bumps and hollows.

 

418483674_Screenshot_20201124-1330521.png.a41d28d7fd87b342f0e203b26aab4667.png

 

(cue music, overhead helicopter shot)

 

The drive must be struck solidly if the player is to have any hope at this green in regulation, and should favor the right side of the fairway for the best angle of approach. Too far right is not good however, as a copse of trees, some of the only trees on the interior of the property, stand guard, and the last 15 yards of fairway up that side slope severely towards the rough.

 

IMG_1503.JPG.39a178811882a6a5dcf1a9ab12abd797.JPG

 

This hole really shows her teeth on the approach, however, which demands a long iron, hybrid, or fairway wood of mortals to the tune 210-230 yards. A small creek cuts in front of the green from right to left, and bunkers right demand pinpoint accuracy from long range. Layups are no picnic either, as the fairway tapers down closer to the green, and the angle left brings the small left side bunker into play, with the far side bunkers now beckoning for overcooked wedge.

 

IMG_20190814_123425.jpg.2cadeafffde4d1383f27538de27b0631.jpg

 

The player's work is not done once he has reached this massive, three-tiered putting surface. At just over 40 yards deep with over 2 feet of elevation change across the tier, the contours of this green demand precision approaches, or failing that, impressive lag putting.

 

This was ranked the 3rd hardest hole in Finland, and in my time playing it, over 30 rounds, I have 0 birdies, 3 pars, and a LOT of 'others'.

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190 yards always into the wind and the greens about 15 yards deep and 70 wide.  Eats me up more often than not 

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This is No. 16 at Stonewolf GC in Fairview Heights, IL. 

Par 4 | 320 from White |  370 from Black

 

image.png.aaa0c9c1310e236bdd98ee96047802b0.pngOne of the Curse of 16 holes in St. Clair County. A companion hole, No. 16 at The Orchards. Both run through the low part of each course, and have trouble with fairway sogginess in rainy weeks.

 

At our course, the hole is bordered by hazards on both left and right (medium green border). Tough to find the ball on either side. Dotted red area is perpetual "ground under repair" from vacated bunker, kept soggy by runoff from hillside. If the ball rolls in and disappears it's no penalty - local rule - but you lose a ball.

 

Challenge: You need to get the ball past the 150-yd. marker as far as you can until fairway goes to 10-yds. wide at 100-yd. point (two red dots). And, you have to take into account a quartering headwind (see arrow). 

 

Tee Shot Options: coming off a slight hill, a 4i (I get low and hot, negate the wind) or a hybrid from the shorter tees. They moved the white tees back 15 yards, which actually helps... lower ball hits fairway and gives a little runout. (Black tees are 15 feet higher than whites, so aggressive tee shot is really risky for them due to wind.)

 

Next, assuming fairway lie, you have a shot into a angle-set crowned green, with deep bunkers left side and front right. Plus the green's shoulders are soft and rounded from all the rain drainage, and a shot with a little side spin is in the sand. And, the gusting wind can bleed off a half-club of distance - depending upon when you make impact.

 

And, last 120 yards of fairway can give you odd lies during a rainy week.

 

For approach, unless you're on target that day, it's best to play to back half of green, and lag back to any pins close to front. The green drains slightly to the left, and I hit a draw, so pin hunting is risky for me.  Green is fairly level for putting - if you can ever get there.

 

I saw a scratch golfer with a chance for an even-par round blow it with a 7 on this hole.

 

As a regular I can usually manage a bogie, but I also have a big number every few rounds.

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There are a few holes on certain courses I play where I am always guaranteed a blow up hole for whatever reason, like par on them is good for me. Most of the time the hole itself isn't hard but just how it looks to me is what screws me up. Next year I'm hoping to concur these holes as I also hopefully improve my game. 

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These are the make or break holes. I have a hole very similar and hit my straightest club if that makes sense and I accept being out 170 yards. I give up the distance to have a shot at the fairway and a shot at the green. I say practice different variations and see what gets you the best shot at par or better

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As a fellow lefty who faces several holes with OB tight left on his home track including a par 5 with a nearly identical tree window as you've pictured, I would tee up slightly further right on the box and take the longest club I knew I could turn a hard draw with. That would maximize the opening in the trees and get the ball working away from the trouble left. I would hit a long iron, hybrid, or fairway wood. Modern drivers are too unpredictable to get the draw. 

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1 minute ago, Dr. Block said:

As a fellow lefty who faces several holes with OB tight left on his home track including a par 5 with a nearly identical tree window as you've pictured, I would tee up further right on the box and take the longest club I knew I could turn a hard draw with. That would maximize the opening in the trees and get the ball working away from the trouble left. I would hit a long iron, hybrid, or fairway wood. Modern drivers are too unpredictable to get the draw. 

 

For now I can drop my 3h right on the 150 marker, but I will learn to hit a draw with my driver, dammit.

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10 minutes ago, lefthack said:

 

For now I can drop my 3h right on the 150 marker, but I will learn to hit a draw with my driver, dammit.

150-180 in would be more than fine for me if it was a hole I wanted to make no worse than a bogey on. I'd never hit my driver off that tee again. Get it in play, leave yourself in a place where you can have a decent pitch if you miss the green, and hopefully do no worse then a reasonable par putt. Trouble hole solved.

 

Don't beat yourself up over drawing the modern driver. They are designed to hit the ball high and straight more than they are to be able to work the ball.  You'll have a much easier time getting the ball to draw consistently with your three wood.  

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1 hour ago, lefthack said:

My driver isn't THAT modern ('05?), but I try to work on a solid swing vs rely on hardware assistance. I have reduced my slice to a workable fade, but that won't help you on 5. 

 

I hit 3h to 6i onto the green today on 5, I will take that.

I feel ya. My swing is very much made for a fade as well. If I want to get the draw needed on the tee shot for that hole, I'd have to aim quite a bit left and close the face, basically hitting more of a slight pull that draws.  It isn't the prettiest way to get the ball moving in that direction, but it can be very reliable. 

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On 11/21/2020 at 6:00 PM, lefthack said:

Hole 5 kicks my but almost every time. You have about a 20 yard window to drive through and there is a pond down the left side. As a lefty, if it goes at all left, it's gone.

 

I can hit anything off the tee fine except my driver that I still slice at times. I am stubborn and hit my driver because I'm supposed to. I have lost balls left and right on this damn hole.

 

Do you have that one hole? 🤣

PXL_20201121_230818243.jpg

PXL_20201121_144243533.jpg

 

 

So that's what the 18th at Augusta would look like after financial struggles coupled with 1970s Los Angeles smog.   I've often wondered..

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On 11/21/2020 at 11:50 PM, aenemated said:

There're a couple from our regular tracks I can think of that I dread ... #16 at Rustic Canyon, #14 at Destroyer ... but the one that I most absolutely hate is #6 at Angeles National. 

 

I love that course so much but that goddamn hole. 

 

It's about 420 yards. Pretty much always playing into the wind and it has a very daunting waste area about 230-240 out that spans a good 50 yards. You kinda have to not hit driver off the tee as it's generally a tighter, dryer course and the ball wants to run. So I tend to always tee off with 3W and that leaves me usually a 5 iron in. And while it's not ACTUALLY a tough shot ... just hit a sold iron. It just LOOKS like one because of how big that waste area is and the way it frames the green. And the green is massive and there's plenty of landing area short ... but visually, it messes with my head and I pretty much never hit a decent approach in the dozens of times I've played it.

 

I think the only time I haven't blown it is when the wind was fierce and I had like 200 in, striped my hybrid and got out of there with a par. That has happened precisely once in the dozens of times I've played it.

 

I get out of there with bogey, I'm pretty happy. That damn hole has ruined my scorecard more than a few times. Of course, the same can be said of #16 at Rustic but I don't have a sense of impending dread as I approach it. 

Just curious, what gets to you at #14 Destroyer? I’ve always seemed to score well on that one.

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2 hours ago, Jwin323 said:

Just curious, what gets to you at #14 Destroyer? I’ve always seemed to score well on that one.

 

It's totally something mental. The trees lining both sides just make it feel like a cramped tee shot, those cursed bunkers on the right side that I find pretty much every time because I try so hard to not lose it left I wind up losing it right ... I don't think I've EVER hit a decent tee shot on that hole. And I've played that course A LOT.

 

Hell, the best I've ever played it was a time I totally just blew my tee shot way over into #6 fairway and striped one of the best 5W's I've ever hit to 15 feet.

 

I love everything about Destroyer (especially the breakfast burritos!) but I just hate that hole haha. 

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On 12/22/2020 at 5:23 PM, Hawkeye77 said:

My wife says I am that one hole ----------- here through the holidays.

 

That pic in the OP doesn't even look like a fair fight, especially with a dogleg left.  I assume there is some plan to deal with the trees (they won't get smaller) or will you need to go up there some night and drill some Roundup into them?

 

At the rate I've been busting limbs off, it should be pretty clear by Summer.

 

Even using my 3 or 4 hybrid that I hit straight, you need to watch your aim on the right. 

 

Once I get my draw dialed, it should be ok. 

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#14 at a course that I (luckily) only play a few times a year.  570 yard par 5 dogleg right which is pretty healthy considering the course is a par 72 measuring only 6300 yards.  Landing area off the tee slopes from right to left.  Fairway starts to bend at about 225 yards.  OB left the whole way.  Trees lining the right side of the hole from tee to green so there's no cutting any part of the dog leg.  Green is elevated with rough all around.

 

I'd also like to add that I'm not a fader of the ball and my miss is a duck hook with driver.  I usually go with less than driver off the tee just to minimize the chance the OB left which leaves me quite a ways back.  The layup still isn't the easiest with the slope of the fairway but it flattens out the closer you get to the hole.  I'm feeling like a million bucks if I'm lying two in the fairway anywhere inside 175.

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11 hours ago, aenemated said:

 

It's totally something mental. The trees lining both sides just make it feel like a cramped tee shot, those cursed bunkers on the right side that I find pretty much every time because I try so hard to not lose it left I wind up losing it right ... I don't think I've EVER hit a decent tee shot on that hole. And I've played that course A LOT.

 

Hell, the best I've ever played it was a time I totally just blew my tee shot way over into #6 fairway and striped one of the best 5W's I've ever hit to 15 feet.

 

I love everything about Destroyer (especially the breakfast burritos!) but I just hate that hole haha. 

I love that course also. All the holes are different. I like how it goes from tree lined to completely exposed to the wind, especially the last three holes. Strong set of par 5s. First time I played a retired Navy officer told me I had to try the egg salad sando. He was right. Still one of the best I’ve had.

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6 hours ago, Jwin323 said:

I love that course also. All the holes are different. I like how it goes from tree lined to completely exposed to the wind, especially the last three holes. Strong set of par 5s. First time I played a retired Navy officer told me I had to try the egg salad sando. He was right. Still one of the best I’ve had.

 

Yeah, I've said exactly that about how every hole is unique. #16 is one of my favorite holes I've played ever. #17 is such a great par 3 - I've hit everything from 7 iron to 5W on that hole depending on the wind and where the tees are set up. #18 is a great closer with that monstrous fairway and no real trouble so you can really go after it off the tee. 

 

I pretty much always get the breakfast burrito when teeing off and grab a hot dog on the way out. Best dogs ever. 

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Posted about it before, but hole 8 on my home course. Only 500 yard par five from the back tees.

 

Water entire way right, Forest left the entire hole. Dog legs right and the creek wraps around the back of the green about 7 paces off the back edge.

 

The problem I have with the hole is that for a longer hitter say carrying 250+ you only have about a 10 yard wide strip you can land the ball unless you hug the water right. Anything too far left is in the trees, anything right is wet. If you hit it in the 280 or so range the dogleg starts making the landing area tight.


Laying up there are over hanging trees to be aware of (All the left side forest I mentioned) so a mis-hit layup could be in jail. The green slopes to the creek behind the green too so it can add a little anxiety. Laying up to the 100 marker is smart but the water on the right juts out to the fairway right at that yardage so the layup can be tough too.

 

A good hole. I've seen a lot of high scores there in tournaments. Usually I go 3 hybrid/3 hybrid and take my chances with a half wedge that I can hopefully spin a bit.

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