Rocco and Alcohol

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  • rawdograwdog Cleveland, OHMembers Posts: 3,015 ✭✭
    This thread has been a pleasant surprise for its tone.



    Congrats on all you guys for being sober, and enlightening everyone on the challenges of this addiction.
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  • tdk8180tdk8180 Members Posts: 2,405 ✭✭
    edited Feb 7, 2019 10:09pm #63
    I play with guys that rely on alcohol, cigarettes, pot, chew...etc. They need it to play, they cant play without it.



    In my opinion, it should be illegal to use in sports. But the way I feel is this. If I win or beat them, they have to live with the fact that their crutch broke. I dont have to live with that reality after the round, so right after their "win" on the course ends, I win and they lose. And that constant losing will perpetuate the problem. I cant help people with problems they can fix immediately. I help the helpless, not the foolish.



    Anyone that has beat addiction, has beat it because they wanted to, not because someone helped them do it. They might have been encouraged, but in the end the choice is theirs to get better.



    There are better people than I to assist people with problems I cant imagine having.



    My money and time goes to different causes.
  • Big Cat 3Big Cat 3 Members Posts: 631 ✭✭


    I remember a story from my buddies grandparents down in palm desert that they saw Arnold Palmer at the bar after a round and he was sloppy drunk and being flirty with the ladies. This must have been around 1998. I remember thinking at the time that was funny as ****, but now thinking back it's kind of sad.



    I remember Haney in his book saying that the club pro persona was to teach all day and hit the club bar in the late afternoon for a few drinks. He did that for a long time I guess and finally one day said he was tired of waking up hungover. Cold turkey, just like that.



    I think golf being so cerebral lends itself to finding the desire to get out of your headspace and booze is so convenient.
    drink early enough you don’t hang over
  • Big Cat 3Big Cat 3 Members Posts: 631 ✭✭
    playar32 wrote:


    Heard this on golf channel/ESPN. Rocco said he became an alcoholic to avoid pain on the course. Not absolving him, but good for him for getting sober and being willing to talk about it.



    Funny think he said was that virtually everyone knew. Has to be others on tour doing this right? (I know this is a perpetual question between drinking/popping pills on tour). As much as golf is not physical, guys will do whatever they can to survive.
    Rocco looks good with the no booze weight loss
  • Ronnie MundtRonnie Mundt Members Posts: 127 ✭✭
    tdk8180 wrote:


    I play with guys that rely on alcohol, cigarettes, pot, chew...etc. They need it to play, they cant play without it.



    In my opinion, it should be illegal to use in sports. But the way I feel is this. If I win or beat them, they have to live with the fact that their crutch broke. I dont have to live with that reality after the round, so right after their "win" on the course ends, I win and they lose. And that constant losing will perpetuate the problem. I cant help people with problems they can fix immediately. I help the helpless, not the foolish.



    Anyone that has beat addiction, has beat it because they wanted to, not because someone helped them do it. They might have been encouraged, but in the end the choice is theirs to get better.



    There are better people than I to assist people with problems I cant imagine having.



    My money and time goes to different causes.




    You sound like a really fun guy to play with.
  • Ronnie MundtRonnie Mundt Members Posts: 127 ✭✭
    My boy Rocco is from Greensburg, PA. Anyone here ever been to Greensburg? Well I have and he wasn’t the only one drinking in that town, I’ll tell you that.
  • tdk8180tdk8180 Members Posts: 2,405 ✭✭

    tdk8180 wrote:


    I play with guys that rely on alcohol, cigarettes, pot, chew...etc. They need it to play, they cant play without it.



    In my opinion, it should be illegal to use in sports. But the way I feel is this. If I win or beat them, they have to live with the fact that their crutch broke. I dont have to live with that reality after the round, so right after their "win" on the course ends, I win and they lose. And that constant losing will perpetuate the problem. I cant help people with problems they can fix immediately. I help the helpless, not the foolish.



    Anyone that has beat addiction, has beat it because they wanted to, not because someone helped them do it. They might have been encouraged, but in the end the choice is theirs to get better.



    There are better people than I to assist people with problems I cant imagine having.



    My money and time goes to different causes.




    You sound like a really fun guy to play with.




    I AM! And I dont need alcohol to do it either!
  • Big Cat 3Big Cat 3 Members Posts: 631 ✭✭


    I remember a story from my buddies grandparents down in palm desert that they saw Arnold Palmer at the bar after a round and he was sloppy drunk and being flirty with the ladies. This must have been around 1998. I remember thinking at the time that was funny as ****, but now thinking back it's kind of sad.



    I remember Haney in his book saying that the club pro persona was to teach all day and hit the club bar in the late afternoon for a few drinks. He did that for a long time I guess and finally one day said he was tired of waking up hungover. Cold turkey, just like that.



    I think golf being so cerebral lends itself to finding the desire to get out of your headspace and booze is so convenient.
    Arnie was a renowned sexual predator ... that made his poor wife miserable and pissed off a lot of married men when he would brazenly hit on their wives. Not so hidden secret.
  • Ronnie MundtRonnie Mundt Members Posts: 127 ✭✭
    tdk8180 wrote:


    tdk8180 wrote:


    I play with guys that rely on alcohol, cigarettes, pot, chew...etc. They need it to play, they cant play without it.



    In my opinion, it should be illegal to use in sports. But the way I feel is this. If I win or beat them, they have to live with the fact that their crutch broke. I dont have to live with that reality after the round, so right after their "win" on the course ends, I win and they lose. And that constant losing will perpetuate the problem. I cant help people with problems they can fix immediately. I help the helpless, not the foolish.



    Anyone that has beat addiction, has beat it because they wanted to, not because someone helped them do it. They might have been encouraged, but in the end the choice is theirs to get better.



    There are better people than I to assist people with problems I cant imagine having.



    My money and time goes to different causes.




    You sound like a really fun guy to play with.




    I AM! And I dont need alcohol to do it either!




    I know I’m just breaking balls. I’ve played with guys like that too that seem to be on 4-5 substances by the time we walk of the 18th green. Some of them needed to go pick their kids up and it puzzled me...
  • naval2006naval2006 ArgentinaMembers Posts: 966 ✭✭
    When I was in my teens playing with club pros that hadn't made it big time but who played great golf I remember all of them hit the bottle after the round and on Sat-Sun tourneys they'd get real drunk and played on Sunday with a terrible hangover. A few of them played their best hangoverish. The few times they lead on Saturday and didn't go out at night to keep their game for Sunday the'd perform awfully. Let's say pros Rocco's age was commonplace to drink when not playing. And like they said above, pro life is really hard and solitary, especially when you're not a top gun.



    Great posts by those who have been on the wagon for a while. I don't drink much but I assume it must have made a heck of a difference in life.
  • bladehunterbladehunter Today was a good day.... Members Posts: 25,830 ✭✭
    edited Feb 8, 2019 8:09am #72
    Big Cat 3 wrote:



    I remember a story from my buddies grandparents down in palm desert that they saw Arnold Palmer at the bar after a round and he was sloppy drunk and being flirty with the ladies. This must have been around 1998. I remember thinking at the time that was funny as ****, but now thinking back it's kind of sad.



    I remember Haney in his book saying that the club pro persona was to teach all day and hit the club bar in the late afternoon for a few drinks. He did that for a long time I guess and finally one day said he was tired of waking up hungover. Cold turkey, just like that.



    I think golf being so cerebral lends itself to finding the desire to get out of your headspace and booze is so convenient.
    Arnie was a renowned sexual predator ... that made his poor wife miserable and pissed off a lot of married men when he would brazenly hit on their wives. Not so hidden secret.




    Assholish thing to say. “ predator” incinuates a lot of vile things.
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  • FergusonFerguson Members Posts: 4,674 ✭✭
    For the guy who called out Arnie:



    You were not there and you don’t know.









    For the guy who claimed : “Other than your last statement, so wrong in so many ways.”



    I disagree. Other than those chemically affected in the womb or as a result of medical treatment - the choice to abuse drugs or alcohol beyond one's limit is entirely the in the hands of the individual. In other words, and staying on topic, no one except Rocco put the booze into his body.

    Addiction is the inability to stop.




    Please help me to understand how the booze entered his body if it wasn’t by his own hands.









    For the guy who said:



    “Rocco drinks due to a high percentage of others in the same town who are drunks.”



    That’s like a school kid after failing a test, “but everyone else did too” and that somehow makes it okay.









    For the guy who said:



    “Golf is so cerebral” that it lends itself to the heavy consumption of alcohol.



    That’s just foolish.
  • new2g0lfnew2g0lf Members Posts: 3,382 ✭✭
    edited Feb 8, 2019 10:22am #74
    Ferguson wrote:


    For the guy who called out Arnie:



    You were not there and you don’t know.









    For the guy who claimed : “Other than your last statement, so wrong in so many ways.”



    I disagree. Other than those chemically affected in the womb or as a result of medical treatment - the choice to abuse drugs or alcohol beyond one's limit is entirely the in the hands of the individual. In other words, and staying on topic, no one except Rocco put the booze into his body.

    Addiction is the inability to stop.




    Please help me to understand how the booze entered his body if it wasn’t by his own hands.









    For the guy who said:



    “Rocco drinks due to a high percentage of others in the same town who are drunks.”



    That’s like a school kid after failing a test, “but everyone else did too” and that somehow makes it okay.









    For the guy who said:



    “Golf is so cerebral” that it lends itself to the heavy consumption of alcohol.



    That’s just foolish.




    Lots of truth here, seems people like to make excuses or justify the poor life decisions others make. Just because some wish to hold the individual accountable for their actions or addictions doesn't mean we don't have compassion for them. I'm glad Rocco is in a better place, hopefully he stays away from the booze and I wish him nothing but the best.
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  • FergusonFerguson Members Posts: 4,674 ✭✭
    new2g0lf wrote:

    Ferguson wrote:


    For the guy who called out Arnie:



    You were not there and you don’t know.









    For the guy who claimed : “Other than your last statement, so wrong in so many ways.”



    I disagree. Other than those chemically affected in the womb or as a result of medical treatment - the choice to abuse drugs or alcohol beyond one's limit is entirely the in the hands of the individual. In other words, and staying on topic, no one except Rocco put the booze into his body.

    Addiction is the inability to stop.




    Please help me to understand how the booze entered his body if it wasn’t by his own hands.









    For the guy who said:



    “Rocco drinks due to a high percentage of others in the same town who are drunks.”



    That’s like a school kid after failing a test, “but everyone else did too” and that somehow makes it okay.









    For the guy who said:



    “Golf is so cerebral” that it lends itself to the heavy consumption of alcohol.



    That’s just foolish.




    Lots of truth here, seems people like to make excuses or justify the poor life decisions others make. Just because some wish to hold the individual accountable for their actions or addictions doesn't mean we don't have compassion for them. I'm glad Rocco is in a better place, hopefully he stays away from the booze and I wish him nothing but the best.






    I have compassion for those people that have the courage to stand up, admit they have a problem and face it with a solution. Now, I fully understand that solution might take months or even years. But for those who don't try at all and make excuse after excuse - you alone are choosing your destiny. Just don't get into a car with your habit behind the wheel and an endless bag of excuses in the passenger seat when my friends and family are on the same roads.
  • Ronnie MundtRonnie Mundt Members Posts: 127 ✭✭
    new2g0lf wrote:

    Ferguson wrote:


    For the guy who called out Arnie:



    You were not there and you don’t know.









    For the guy who claimed : “Other than your last statement, so wrong in so many ways.”



    I disagree. Other than those chemically affected in the womb or as a result of medical treatment - the choice to abuse drugs or alcohol beyond one's limit is entirely the in the hands of the individual. In other words, and staying on topic, no one except Rocco put the booze into his body.

    Addiction is the inability to stop.




    Please help me to understand how the booze entered his body if it wasn’t by his own hands.









    For the guy who said:



    “Rocco drinks due to a high percentage of others in the same town who are drunks.”



    That’s like a school kid after failing a test, “but everyone else did too” and that somehow makes it okay.









    For the guy who said:



    “Golf is so cerebral” that it lends itself to the heavy consumption of alcohol.



    That’s just foolish.




    Lots of truth here, seems people like to make excuses or justify the poor life decisions others make. Just because some wish to hold the individual accountable for their actions or addictions doesn't mean we don't have compassion for them. I'm glad Rocco is in a better place, hopefully he stays away from the booze and I wish him nothing but the best.




    I don’t see a modicum of truth in his post. Not an iota.
  • dlygrissedlygrisse Members Posts: 13,113 ✭✭
    tdk8180 wrote:


    I play with guys that rely on alcohol, cigarettes, pot, chew...etc. They need it to play, they cant play without it.



    In my opinion, it should be illegal to use in sports. But the way I feel is this. If I win or beat them, they have to live with the fact that their crutch broke. I dont have to live with that reality after the round, so right after their "win" on the course ends, I win and they lose. And that constant losing will perpetuate the problem. I cant help people with problems they can fix immediately. I help the helpless, not the foolish.



    Anyone that has beat addiction, has beat it because they wanted to, not because someone helped them do it. They might have been encouraged, but in the end the choice is theirs to get better.



    There are better people than I to assist people with problems I cant imagine having.



    My money and time goes to different causes.




    Some people rely on non-performance enhancing drugs. It's really just a crutch, but a mental crutch will usually help in the short term, rarely in the long term. I've been there, and don't mind a few beverages while playing, but if you think it helps your game, you are lying to yourself.



    Everyone handles alcohol a bit differently, for the bulk of the population it's generally not a problem, most people have enough self control and good sense to not let it adversely affect their lives. For those that have struggled with it I understand why they think it's evil, but I would guess 90% of the people I know consume alcohol and 99% of those people seem to manage it just fine. Yes I know a couple of people who I wish would quit. I also know a few people that have eating disorders and it is destroying their lives as well, that doesn't mean everyone should quit eating either.



    That being said, good for Rocco, I hope he lives a long happy life, however he needs to do it.

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  • FergusonFerguson Members Posts: 4,674 ✭✭

    new2g0lf wrote:

    Ferguson wrote:


    For the guy who called out Arnie:



    You were not there and you don't know.









    For the guy who claimed : "Other than your last statement, so wrong in so many ways."



    I disagree. Other than those chemically affected in the womb or as a result of medical treatment - the choice to abuse drugs or alcohol beyond one's limit is entirely the in the hands of the individual. In other words, and staying on topic, no one except Rocco put the booze into his body.

    Addiction is the inability to stop.




    Please help me to understand how the booze entered his body if it wasn't by his own hands.









    For the guy who said:



    "Rocco drinks due to a high percentage of others in the same town who are drunks."



    That's like a school kid after failing a test, "but everyone else did too" and that somehow makes it okay.









    For the guy who said:



    "Golf is so cerebral" that it lends itself to the heavy consumption of alcohol.



    That's just foolish.




    Lots of truth here, seems people like to make excuses or justify the poor life decisions others make. Just because some wish to hold the individual accountable for their actions or addictions doesn't mean we don't have compassion for them. I'm glad Rocco is in a better place, hopefully he stays away from the booze and I wish him nothing but the best.




    I don't see a modicum of truth in his post. Not an iota.








    Perhaps representing a cross section of professional bar goers replete with beer goggles, poor judgement and the inability to operate heavy machinery?
  • SheriffBoothSheriffBooth Marshals, BST Volunteer Mods Posts: 4,438 mod
    Please don't let this thread descend into personal attacks and back and forth bickering over differences of opinion.
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  • new2g0lfnew2g0lf Members Posts: 3,382 ✭✭
    Most of the guys in my golf circle do not drink or use other substances while they golf but a few do. One in particular cannot play close to his handicap unless he vapes THC oil or smokes pot. I don't know why since he's emphatic that pot isn't addictive but we know as soon as well smell skunk he's going to start playing better.



    If Rocco turned to alcohol for pain relief then he probably did himself a favor rather than get hooked on Oxy, I know alcohol can do damage but I've seen too many of my friends kids turn to heroin after battling a Oxy / opiate addiction, nasty stuff.
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  • FergusonFerguson Members Posts: 4,674 ✭✭
    new2g0lf wrote:


    Most of the guys in my golf circle do not drink or use other substances while they golf but a few do. One in particular cannot play close to his handicap unless he vapes THC oil or smokes pot. I don't know why since he's emphatic that pot isn't addictive but we know as soon as well smell skunk he's going to start playing better.



    If Rocco turned to alcohol for pain relief then he probably did himself a favor rather than get hooked on Oxy, I know alcohol can do damage but I've seen too many of my friends kids turn to heroin after battling a Oxy / opiate addiction, nasty stuff.






    I just don't understand why Rocco would turn to booze and not his friends or family.

    I guess I will never know - I am not wired that way.
  • Swisstrader98Swisstrader98 Members Posts: 3,519 ✭✭
    edited Feb 8, 2019 11:48am #82
    I always find it amazing that some people can play better w weed or alcohol in their systems, but I’ve witnessed it myself.



    My buddy and I were all geared up for last years member/member tournament and I just happen to see the guy we’re playing against lighting up a joint just before we’re going out to play. My buddy and I are like, man, he’s done...we win for sure! WRONG!



    The guy played lights out for 18 holes even tho he looked completely baked and couldn’t put 2 sentences together. I don’t know how that works but in my younger days if I even smelled a whiff, I would be half asleep and barely able to function.



    Bascially, he was hammered and we got hammered😂
  • wmblake2000wmblake2000 Members Posts: 5,699 ✭✭
    Ferguson wrote:
    new2g0lf wrote:


    Most of the guys in my golf circle do not drink or use other substances while they golf but a few do. One in particular cannot play close to his handicap unless he vapes THC oil or smokes pot. I don't know why since he's emphatic that pot isn't addictive but we know as soon as well smell skunk he's going to start playing better.



    If Rocco turned to alcohol for pain relief then he probably did himself a favor rather than get hooked on Oxy, I know alcohol can do damage but I've seen too many of my friends kids turn to heroin after battling a Oxy / opiate addiction, nasty stuff.






    I just don't understand why Rocco would turn to booze and not his friends or family.

    I guess I will never know - I am not wired that way.




    I’m sober 15 yrs. I drank alcoholicly right from the outset as a teen. My friends drank much more moderately. I never did but didn’t really recognize it was a problem until it was too late. Then it took me forever to get sober.



    We humans are definitely are wired differently.
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  • dropkickeddropkicked TorontoMembers Posts: 493 ✭✭
    For those who missed the GD, article on Marijuana and Golf.. You would be surprised what a small joint will do to relax your game and set your mind right..

    I am in Toronto, Canada.. So this is nothing new as many locals enjoy some cannabis before and during a round..



    https://www.golfdigest.com/story/how-does-marijuana-affect-your-golf-game-an-investigation



    Disclaimer: Recreational Cannabis use is legal here now (and unofficially for the past many decades)

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  • bladehunterbladehunter Today was a good day.... Members Posts: 25,830 ✭✭
    edited Feb 8, 2019 12:19pm #85
    Ferguson wrote:

    new2g0lf wrote:


    Most of the guys in my golf circle do not drink or use other substances while they golf but a few do. One in particular cannot play close to his handicap unless he vapes THC oil or smokes pot. I don't know why since he's emphatic that pot isn't addictive but we know as soon as well smell skunk he's going to start playing better.



    If Rocco turned to alcohol for pain relief then he probably did himself a favor rather than get hooked on Oxy, I know alcohol can do damage but I've seen too many of my friends kids turn to heroin after battling a Oxy / opiate addiction, nasty stuff.






    I just don't understand why Rocco would turn to booze and not his friends or family.

    I guess I will never know - I am not wired that way.




    I don’t know either Ferg. I don’t know His family situation. But I can say from experience that not everyone has that soft place to land. When you’re the only sane one of the bunch it gets tough. When you have an issue there’s not anyplace to turn. You tend to internalize it and try to make the pain stop however you can. Not saying Rocco is in that predicament, but it’s a viable “ cause and effect “ if he was.
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  • ebrasmus21ebrasmus21 Serial Shanker CAMembers Posts: 5,328 ✭✭
    This thread has hit me right in the feels. One of the more meaningful threads I've seen on this site.



    Thank you to everyone who's shared struggles.



    I have an addictive personality and I travel for work. I don't typically drink at home; me and the wife rarely have booze in the house at all. But on the road I drink out of boredom.



    Both my grandfathers were alcoholics. Feel like I'm playing with fire.
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  • FergusonFerguson Members Posts: 4,674 ✭✭
    edited Feb 8, 2019 12:32pm #87

    Ferguson wrote:

    new2g0lf wrote:


    Most of the guys in my golf circle do not drink or use other substances while they golf but a few do. One in particular cannot play close to his handicap unless he vapes THC oil or smokes pot. I don't know why since he's emphatic that pot isn't addictive but we know as soon as well smell skunk he's going to start playing better.



    If Rocco turned to alcohol for pain relief then he probably did himself a favor rather than get hooked on Oxy, I know alcohol can do damage but I've seen too many of my friends kids turn to heroin after battling a Oxy / opiate addiction, nasty stuff.






    I just don't understand why Rocco would turn to booze and not his friends or family.

    I guess I will never know - I am not wired that way.




    I don't know either Ferg. I don't know His family situation. But I can say from experience that not everyone has that soft place to land. When you're the only sane one of the bunch it gets tough. When you have an issue there's not anyplace to turn. You tend to internalize it and try to make the pain stop however you can. Not saying Rocco is in that predicament, but it's a viable " cause and effect " if he was.






    I think maintaining a good network of a few good people helps. I have a couple of close friends that would literally kick the daylights out of me (and I them) if we spotted abuse in one another. Zero tolerance. These are people I met after college, so we are not lifelong friends.



    We are not "squares" by any means. We drink, sure - but, the booze never takes center stage. I guess we all have experienced it in one way shape or form (friend or family member) and just care enough about each other to not let one go down that path. I love these guys for it. It's like insurance.
  • dlygrissedlygrisse Members Posts: 13,113 ✭✭
    Ferguson wrote:


    Ferguson wrote:

    new2g0lf wrote:


    Most of the guys in my golf circle do not drink or use other substances while they golf but a few do. One in particular cannot play close to his handicap unless he vapes THC oil or smokes pot. I don't know why since he's emphatic that pot isn't addictive but we know as soon as well smell skunk he's going to start playing better.



    If Rocco turned to alcohol for pain relief then he probably did himself a favor rather than get hooked on Oxy, I know alcohol can do damage but I've seen too many of my friends kids turn to heroin after battling a Oxy / opiate addiction, nasty stuff.






    I just don't understand why Rocco would turn to booze and not his friends or family.

    I guess I will never know - I am not wired that way.




    I don't know either Ferg. I don't know His family situation. But I can say from experience that not everyone has that soft place to land. When you're the only sane one of the bunch it gets tough. When you have an issue there's not anyplace to turn. You tend to internalize it and try to make the pain stop however you can. Not saying Rocco is in that predicament, but it's a viable " cause and effect " if he was.






    I think maintaining a good network of a few good people helps. I have a couple of close friends that would literally kick the daylights out of me (and I them) if we spotted abuse in one another. Zero tolerance. These are people I met after college, so we are not lifelong friends.



    We are not "squares" by any means. We drink, sure - but, the booze never takes center stage. I guess we all have experienced it in one way shape or form (friend or family member) and just care enough about each other to not let one go down that path. I love these guys for it. It's like insurance.




    That is great for you, truly it is. My guess is that Rocco doesn't have the same close network of friends, and was either being enabled by the people he hung with or was hiding it from others that would say something. I have seen that kind of thing happen more than once.

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  • tbowles411tbowles411 ClubWRX Posts: 25,112 ✭✭
    I grew up in a alcoholic home. I just didn't know what I was going to find when I got there or how violent it would be. It's probably the reason if I have 5 drinks in a year, that's a lot. That's why I'm very careful. I don't want to expose that to my son.



    On FB on the GD and WRX articles many are making light of Rocco's struggles. It's a sad statement. Addictions of all types can destroy you and those around you. It's refreshing to see a thread where folks are willing to be transparent enough to share. Everyone has their cross to bear. Golfers are people and they're far from perfect. Rocco struggled with pain and tried to find some peace as other people did, even TW. Many like to judge and lose empathy for someone else. I look at those people with knowing eyes, just because I had to watch it and continue to be vigilant because that could be me one day.
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  • Matt JMatt J Members Posts: 8,717 ✭✭
    A lot of people simply don't have anyone. Close family members are stuck between being alienated or staying quiet.



    Age plays a big factor too. Your kidneys and liver aren't getting more efficient and then you tax them like that, it ages you quickly. A lot of metabolic problems can arise, too. Alcohol typically comes in the form of a simple carb to your body. Guys can't sleep (which becomes harder as you age, too).



    I'va always felt that if you don't really overdue it when you're younger you're likely to achieve some balance out of how hard it is on your body. The fact that you can trick your body into needing something that is poisonous is pretty powerful. Addiction is multi-faceted, very complicated, and nothing to be toyed with.... if you have any questions about your usage the easiest way to answer them is 45 days of sobriety. It takes 20 or 30 days to really detox and start to feel 'normal'again. That tells you a lot.
  • ExTrumpetExTrumpet Members Posts: 473 ✭✭
    I term I've never understood is "functioning alcoholic." Seems like an oxymoron to me.
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